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Manhunt rules

mandevian
about 6 years

Anyone not in the game (including mods) is not allowed to tell you how to play this setup. If you think a certain action is playing towards your win condition, you have every right to take that action. However, there are certain situations where you must follow follow some rules. Asking people to read this thread during the game is NOT OGI.

If you have to choose between two options in the game and those options will lead to 1) certain loss or 2) even a 0.000001% chance to win, you must do #2. It is gamethrowing to do #1. Example scenarios are below:

For the purposes of this guide, SCUM = Spy/Stalker/Killer

1: You are Hunter/Agent/Vigilante/Jailer in a 3-way with Killer & Spy/Stalker:

  • Voting anything other than "no lynch" IS GT.
  • If you are Jailer, and you no lynch, jailing either of them IS GT.
  • If you are Vigilante, and you no lynch, shooting at night is NOT GT. If killer kills mafia and mafia no kills, you can only win by shooting killer.

2: You are Hunter/Agent/Vigilante/Jailer in a 4-way with Killer and Spy/Stalker:

  • If Vigilante and one other town are alive, and the town thinks that scum does not know who the vig is, then lynching mafia is NOT GT.
  • If Vigilante is not alive or if scum knows the vigilante, then voting anything other than "no lynch" IS GT.
  • If you no lynch, and you are Vigilante, then shooting at night is NOT GT.
  • If you NL, and you are Jailer, and Vigilante is known by scum or is dead, then jailing anyone IS GT.

3: 5-way with 2 scum alive:

  • Lynching known hunter IS GT.
  • If you know a scum, then no lynching IS GT, because you can lynch one scum that day and another tomorrow instead of going into 4- or 3- way with 2 scum.
  • If you lynch on a 5 way, then shooting as Vig is NOT GT.
  • If you NL, then jailing or jailkilling is NOT GT.
  • If you are lynched as Hunter, Vig is dead or known to scum, and killer/a mafia role are alive, then shooting as hunter IS GT.

4: If you are scum in a 3-way involving Killer, Mafia, Town:

  • Lynching Hunter is NOT GT. But it is against the win condition of the Hunter to lynch. Therefore, the Hunter will propose to NL, otherwise they will shoot you. This puts you at a greater risk. You can then make a pact with the other scum and NL and kill the Hunter at night. It is NOT GT to betray or to not betray even though you get a higher payout if you betray and kill the other scum. It is a choice you can make to maximize your payout over several games by setting up your meta that you do not betray.
  • Lynching the other scum is NOT GT if the town is voting with you.

I've likely missed some stuff, so mods please comment any other scenarios with rules to be enforced and I can add them. There are many other scenarios where some actions are suboptimal, but they are subjective to the situation, so we cannot pre define rules for them.

SteelixMega
about 5 years
If both mafia and killer are outed in a 4 way with no vig or jailer, mafia should always nk so killer can't betray and win
deletedabout 5 years
manhunt is very meta and karma based though and if you do that (especially near the start of the round) you'll probably get bit for it later when you get a rep for being an a/ss and get betrayed or the same thing done to you
deletedabout 5 years
you would need to be in 100% autoloss - as long as you have a 0.00001% chance to win, you have to take it

so if you're in a jail meeting, you should be focusing on convincing jailer not to kill you - not outing mafia

if it was after kicks and all votes were on you (and locked), realistically you can't be vioed for outing mafia - you're already in autoloss, and we wouldn't really have a violation for that tbh.. i might be wrong tho
Song
about 5 years

probablytown says

Recently a scenario bothered me where killer is guaranteed to die( most likely in jailer meeting) and has name(s) to bring with himself to graveyard. But question is should he be able to keep the rights to freely ruin any party's game when he can set an example on good sportsmanship?


Was coming here to ask the same quesiton. If Killer is 100% confirmed and garaunteed to be killed by town, but knows who mafia is, can they out the mafia?

The arguements I've heard have all been "not against the rules but still to do".

Essentially it could not be gamethrowing unless you were not in 100% autoloss as killer. If you aren't, then outing as killer can be seen as gamethrowing, and outing mafia could be seen as you throwing the game (and your wincon) out of spite for mafia.

Now if we're talking about scenarios where it's 100% autoloss for killer, then the gamethrowing aspect is tossed out the window. We then should look into the rules and see if there's anything that might fit the description of this event. Looking into it, the closest rule that could be broken is trolling through means of purposely antagonizing other players, however I would consider that a stretch.

Now some might argue that you're playing kingmaker which is a big no-no in these kinds of setups, however just because killer outs mafia doesn't mean that it's an absolute truth. Killer could have decided to throw out 2 random names in order to benefit mafia. If we look at such a reverse scenario, it wouldn't be considered as anything vio-worthy. We can also assume that the arguement of Killer lying about mafia can be established and utilized by mafia in a way that benefits them.

So overall, no I don't believe that doing that should be vio-worthy. However I still believe that a moderator/admin should weigh in on it just to be safe.
probablytown
about 5 years
Recently a scenario bothered me where killer is guaranteed to die( most likely in jailer meeting) and has name(s) to bring with himself to graveyard. But question is should he be able to keep the rights to freely ruin any party's game when he can set an example on good sportsmanship?
TanB
about 5 years
so basically everything you do is considered gt
blacksnakemoan
about 5 years
yes
mandevian
about 5 years
Did someone comp this setup again?
SteelixMega
about 5 years

D3xTr0m3th0rph4n says

beating me in a game IS GT

shady12
about 5 years

Songin says


shady12 says

like this if u luv jesus, quote this if u luv satan




D3xTr0m3th0rph4n
about 5 years
beating me in a game IS GT
Songin
about 5 years

shady12 says

1 cummy?, 2 cummy??, 3 cummy???, 4???? I'm ?daddy's? ?princess ?but I'm also a wh0re! ?

shady12
about 5 years

Songin says

Why has government been instituted at all? Because the passions of man will not conform to the dictates of reason and justice without constraint.

Songin
about 5 years
All your quotes are faked. This is the only real one.


pranay says


This setup is good and shady12 is wrong and Songin is the best player in the game.


shady12
about 5 years

Zhuorb says

bad setup lol



sky says

This set up shouldn't even be a thing.



MisterPresident says


this setup causes a broken competition



denial says


this setup is just stupid in general given how many killing roles there are



MisterPresident says


These aren't site rules. These are special made-up setup rules so that it can barely qualify for competition (I still think it doesn't)



Edark says

Perhaps you shouldnt allow comping these setups to begin with



Jeff says

Agreed.



denial says


bottom line is i don't think it should be comped.. or at the very least probably be very rarely comped



Giga13 says

I feel like anybody who says this setup is good for competitive is just saying that for the lols/jokes/memes and actually really knows that, in that context, it's nothing but a steaming pile of monkey sh­it



shady12 says

This setup is an absolute clusterfuck which absolutely, definitively has no place in the competitive rounds of this site.

Songin
about 5 years

shady12 says

I have prepared a public statement for the record:

"I suck at manhunt and Songin is a God at Epicmafia"

shady12
about 5 years
I have prepared a public statement for the record:

"This setup is an absolute clusterfuck which absolutely, definitively has no place in the competitive rounds of this site. It's fun, like reverse maf or that setup with all the santas is fun. But again, not a competitive setup. Not at all."
Torreador
about 5 years
MEMEHUNT
E
M
E
H
U
N
T
SteelixMega
about 5 years
Why haven't people bumped this yet?
LioneI
over 5 years
Why did nobody bump this all round?
grifiest
almost 6 years
i was the spy in that game. the town stalled and let me messaged stalker what to do tho. weird
blacksnakemoan
almost 6 years
yawn
Giga13
almost 6 years
But if we want the competition to mean anything at all, then in my opinion one necessary step is that Manhunt and other setups with third parties aside from traitor can't be allowed to be comped
Giga13
almost 6 years
I feel like anybody who says this setup is good for competitive is just saying that for the lols/jokes/memes and actually really knows that, in that context, it's nothing but a steaming pile of monkey sh­it

But it's 2018 on epicmafia.com so whatever gets people to play should be advocated for at this point if the goal is to keep the site active for as long as possible. I really don't think allowing/not allowing Manhunt to be comped makes a difference in this regard, and at this point, does it even matter?
Giga13
almost 6 years
Gamethrow requires intent which is yet another reason why this setup is garbage for competitive since autowin can be (and is frequently) blown by anybody and no repercussions can take place. i.e. Good play is less frequently rewarded because of a greater frequency of unpunishable (and therefore unrefundable) high-cost mistakes