almost 7 years

Google defines "hazing" as "the imposition of strenuous, often humiliating, tasks as part of a program of rigorous physical training and initiation."

Hazing IRL has kind of a funny history, especially as of late, but has been a mainstay in special clubs, fraternities/sororities and certain organizations for a very long time.

In Sandbox, however, hazing manifests itself as one of our most self-defeating traditions in the form of Policy. Policy-lynching noavis, who are more often than not new players who wandered into the wrong lobby by accident, is barely a form of hazing at all. Most people who are hazed know that it's coming, but because of the insular nature of this website and how we've developed a sort of dialect, there's no way for a new player to immediately navigate and understand this.

Really it shows a critical lack of awareness when people act as though a new player is going to know all of the EM lingo and how to play, especially Sandbox-specific terms. This website has no tutorial and the game starts speeding by so quick that unless you're just selecting things at random and just trying to run so that you stay in place, you're going to fail.

There's been plenty of threads denouncing the treatment of noavis before, and this isn't really one of those threads. This is more of an address to those in the community that still practice and defending hazing.

A lot of people tell me when I confront them about policy is that noavis ruin games and veg. This just goes back to the fact that this website doesn't have a tutorial. A lot of new players only have experience with something like ToS, which has a very different voting system than EM's. So when they look at their action screen at night and there's no indicator of what to do, how should we expect them to do anything right if their role is more complex than a cop or a doctor?

It's not like there's a way to check what your role does in Sandbox anyway. You have to go to the learn tab, and again: new players probably don't know how to navigate the website. If someone announces that they're new to EM, I'm glad that I see people directing noavis on where to go to get avatars and check out what their role does. But for those of you who are concerned with the game being ruined by noavis, does it really kill you if you help them out before the game starts?

Yeah there's not always going to be time before the game starts to give them a crash course, but if they happen to survive the first night then engage them there. Besides, it's not like you'd be talking about anything worthwhile during the daytime (let's save that for another thread.)

The nihilists in the back of the room will tell me that it doesn't matter if we get new players, that the site is dying or deserves to die. To quote Shounen from my Consensus thread: log out. If you really want EM to die, why are you still here? Looking to prospect in a ghost town? Good luck. And if you really want to terrorize this website, the users, or deprive Lucid of revenue, your efforts are better served in Main Lobby where most new players hang out anyway.

If you're one of the people who lead policy lynchings, I would rather take my gamble with a dozen new players than continue to play with the likes of you. Better the devil you don't know than the devil you do.

over 6 years
Noavis if you read this and want to be part of the cool kids group, start spamming forums in the complaints subforum near the bottom of the screen.
over 6 years
AND FRIEESSSS SHOULD BE FRIED EITHER WAYYYY
over 6 years
A grill, is a grill
over 6 years
just want to reiterate that the current policy is beating weebs and nintendrones. thank you. god bless america.
over 6 years
a policy is a policy. no matter the state of the site.
over 6 years
lol imagine unironically liking noavis
over 6 years

jingahegami says

i see there were no further arguments, i think i won this case


over 6 years
i see there were no further arguments, i think i won this case
almost 7 years
every time i try to help a noavi they sui
almost 7 years
every no-avi i try to help says "I curse your mother upon this desecrated ground. Sandbox will collapse upon the no-avi regime. Hail satan."
deletedalmost 7 years
sometimes when i try and help noavis get an avatar i noticed they say things like "i didnt know what i wanted to make it yet"! they dont really know the culture of the community upon signup and they shouldnt be expected to
almost 7 years

TedTonate says

Noavis also don't show such commitment in being apart of the community by uploading a basic avatar that should theoretically take a minute to do, so why should we show commitment to them in game?


I feel the biggest issue with this critique is 1. they don't know they have to get an avi right away and 2. they don't know how to. They only learn they need an avatar through being hazed, and that only happens if they're not immediately kicked from the game like some hosts do.

Sure, noavis will gt, veg, sui(quite a lot of older users do that as well), but it doesn't hurt to answer any questions a newer player has, or pointing out mistakes they may make. You may be wasting your time on some, but hey, who knows, a less hostile environment will make them more likely to stay and be a part of the community, and pass on that knowledge to other new users as well.

I feel that's why some of them are worth your commitment.
almost 7 years
we should make ebic mafia 21+ so I don't have to hear half you idiots mewling about nonsense every other day.
almost 7 years
almost 7 years
i dont see why a game tutorial video/wiki page/whatever couldnt be user made and linked on the lobby news sections tho lol
almost 7 years
No, it's something lucid should implement (even if it's made by another player) but he won't.
deletedalmost 7 years
you guys act like thats something the mods could actually change
(they cant)
almost 7 years
A tutorial would be nice though. Even a tutorial video or a tutorial game. Something, because it's really hard for new players to get the hang of it. I know it was semi-hard when I joined and that was 2010. Now there are so many roles that I would be immediately turned off upon joining.

This has less to do with hazing and more to do with how to make the site easier to learn, but it's important. It's been talked about before but nothing has ever come of it.
almost 7 years

TedTonate says


If mods want this changed, update the out-dated Learn page to something that is more beneficial for new starters, but until then, sit down and let the community continue with the hazings.


ok come on its really not that hard to be nice to new players and NOT be a toxic community that doesn't try to explain things to people that play for the first time
almost 7 years
Most of us have been subjected to a form of Hazing when we first joined the site. Some are wise enough to get an avatar to avoid such situation and even fewer did this and read up on the "Learn" page. Most noavis have given the community a bad name because of several reasons that a lot of people have pointed out, vegging/game throwing/lack of understanding.

Noavis also don't show such commitment in being apart of the community by uploading a basic avatar that should theoretically take a minute to do, so why should we show commitment to them in game?

Does my view on a noavi change when they finally get an avatar? Sure, because they become more approachable in getting to know them, they become more confident in talking about themselves more and they become more recognisable based on the avatar that I/we will see daily.

But for now, the fact remains that a noavi is still a noavi, a non-commited, unknowledgeable individual that will more than likely veg at night or ask "Why" when being lynched.

If mods want this changed, update the out-dated Learn page to something that is more beneficial for new starters, but until then, sit down and let the community continue with the hazings.
almost 7 years
Jimbei i would appreciate it if you referred to golb by his preferred and actual gender, male. I don't think you would appreciate people mis-gendering you. Jesus fella, keep your trump bigotry off em.
almost 7 years

Alyssa says


Chaika says

What a self righteous post. Hoping to get some cookie points with the community, Golb?


Will this personally affect your life if she does?


Did you reply to the wrong person? This question you're asking me doesn't seem to relate much to my post.
almost 7 years
this thread is a trainwreck
almost 7 years
ya but noavis r gay
almost 7 years

Chaika says

What a self righteous post. Hoping to get some cookie points with the community, Golb?


Will this personally affect your life if she does?