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deletedalmost 9 years

https://epicmafia.com/report/194216

This is the most clear cut not to mention disgusting HC I've ever seen on the site and you just no vio'd it. This is unrelated to the harassment violation I didn't even request be given, which was given for an entirely different thread. The fact that I initially banned thecolonel for this (which is still what should happen, but I digress) is completely irrelevant. It's disgusting that you think the only appropriate violation for this entire affair is a single warning and that he shouldn't even be marked down for hateful comments.

Edit: I appreciate people backing me up on this but I've made my point clearly and the mod team as a whole apparently disagrees. It's regrettable this kind of hate speech isn't dealt with more severely. However, there's no point in bickering further if the mods feel rule technicalities trumps all.

deletedalmost 9 years

Edark says

Every user whom has harassed someone has technically commited both acts since harassment nearly always also covers HC.


Not even slightly, dude.
Edark
almost 9 years
"He doesn't have any hateful comments violations because you're condoning what he said on a technicality. Right now by your rules he has no history of hateful comments despite having posted that. You're still not seeing the problem?"

Every user whom has harassed someone has technically commited both acts since harassment nearly always also covers HC. Do you think its a good idea to give everyone who got an harassment violation to get an additional HC violation?

Its not, and thus its treated this way. Sure it might actually be exploited but at most you get away with 1 extra instance of posting some stupid , which in afterhand once the person has gathered 3 violations could be looked at and corrected to ban the person early. But doing so beforehand? Nah, thats a bad idea and a cause of modabuse.
deletedalmost 9 years

mist says

I used to have a gamethrow alt where I would speak only Japanese gibberish. After I got reported for it once and devante gave me a trolling vio, he messaged the account and just said "You're obviously a troll, if you get reported for this again I'm just skipping to banning you".

Is that in the rules? No. Was he right to do that? Yeah, absolutely.


it's not right cuz 2nd trolling is 12 hours suspension lol
deletedalmost 9 years

nepenthe says

fun fact #1. literally every normal community uses rules as guidelines. every single one. you're harmless? sure, you can come back after an hour instead of a day. you're a disruptive d!ckhead? no one's gonna be easy on you

fun fact #2. so does epicmafia. see also: the tons of users with one vio leashes etc.

edark is just being a prick, nothing to see here


normal mafia communities don't mod cheaters
deletedalmost 9 years

Soluciones says

Edark do us a favor and delete harassment and HC. People offended can turn off the computer. And if it happens to be excessive it's on the ToS you can terminate their account.


Unfortunately, it's not that easy.
deletedalmost 9 years

RonBrewhard says

Can we ban you then? LMAO


r u utah or betrayal, you guys are so alike it's hard to tell
Rutab
almost 9 years
It is extremely unfair to call Edark a prick
deletedalmost 9 years
Edark do us a favor and delete harassment and HC. People offended can turn off the computer. And if it happens to be excessive it's on the ToS you can terminate their account.
deletedalmost 9 years

Edark says

"So you think if he starts posting more hate speech tomorrow, he should only deserve a warning for that since by your precious rules he has no warning for that specific violation."

No he would get a violation which would stack to get him his ban if he kept on going. You could argue since he has already served 24 hours extra ban time its justified.


He doesn't have any hateful comments violations because you're condoning what he said on a technicality. Right now by your rules he has no history of hateful comments despite having posted that. You're still not seeing the problem?


Edark says

Then he wasnt in the right mist.


This really illustrates the problem. A mod stopped an obvious gamethrowing account from ruining an extra 5 or so games but they was in the wrong. That's how your modding philosophy works. And you don't think there's a problem with that.
deletedalmost 9 years
Can we ban you then? LMAO
nepenthe
almost 9 years
fun fact #1. literally every normal community uses rules as guidelines. every single one. you're harmless? sure, you can come back after an hour instead of a day. you're a disruptive d!ckhead? no one's gonna be easy on you

fun fact #2. so does epicmafia. see also: the tons of users with one vio leashes etc.

edark is just being a prick, nothing to see here
Edark
almost 9 years
Then he wasnt in the right mist.
deletedalmost 9 years

mist says

No, I'm asking you to gain an understanding of what rules are and aren't for since you seem to lack it.

Here, lemme give you an example.

I used to have a gamethrow alt where I would speak only Japanese gibberish. After I got reported for it once and devante gave me a trolling vio, he messaged the account and just said "You're obviously a troll, if you get reported for this again I'm just skipping to banning you".

Is that in the rules? No. Was he right to do that? Yeah, absolutely.


yeah well if rules were followed you wouldn't have been unbanned like 6 months early.
if rules were followed i would be unbanned by now. RULES? WAaht dur dfat mean ??
Rutab
almost 9 years
I kinda disagree with the Devante thing if you only had one trolling violation but that's okay I guess
Edark
almost 9 years
"So you think if he starts posting more hate speech tomorrow, he should only deserve a warning for that since by your precious rules he has no warning for that specific violation."

No he would get a violation which would stack to get him his ban if he kept on going. You could argue since he has already served 24 hours extra ban time its justified.
deletedalmost 9 years

Edark says


mist says


Edark says


mist says

In fact, you can just ban him, instead of using technicalities in the rules to protect people who belong on Stormfront.

We do have the rules for a reason, yes. It sounds to me like you don't KNOW what that reason is.


You're asking me to break the rules to ban someone since I dont like them. I cant do that.

Or well technically I could, but for obvious reasons I wont.


No, I'm asking you to gain an understanding of what rules are and aren't for since you seem to lack it.

Here, lemme give you an example.

I used to have a gamethrow alt where I would speak only Japanese gibberish. After I got reported for it once and devante gave me a trolling vio, he messaged the account and just said "You're obviously a troll, if you get reported for this again I'm just skipping to banning you".

Is that in the rules? No. Was he right to do that? Yeah, absolutely.


Technically you could argue its in the rules since he could just looked through your games and determine it was a troll alt thus eligible for multiple violations instantly(due to game violations like trolling/GT/GRS being treated and handed out on a game by game basis.


Wrong; there was only one game to look at when he told me that.
deletedalmost 9 years

Edark says


mist says

Reasons we have rules with a stacking violation system:
-So that users who may not have known better aren't banned for first offenses.
-To provide multiple chances for otherwise positive members of the community to improve their behavior.
-To not take severe action against rare offenders.

NOT reasons we have rules with a stacking violation system:
-To allow users who exist to be vitriolic to get away with a certain amount of spew before they're banned.
-To maximize the amount of trolling a user can do.
-To keep neo-nazis on the site as long as possible.


Indeed, but to avoid bias you cant ban them before they have had their fair share chances to improve like any other user. The amount of chances is the same for anyone or else it would be quite unfair. Since this is his first harassment violation no one can 100% say that his behavior cant improve to the better regardless of what opinion they may have shown.

Banning people outright since I personally think he wont improve is subjective way to moderate and a cause of lot of modabuse which is not a very good idea.



So you think if he starts posting more hate speech tomorrow, he should only deserve a warning for that since by your precious rules he has no warning for that specific violation.

Are you not seeing the problem here yet?

Rutab says

Why was Devante right to do that lmfao


Because it was a gamethrow account and you shouldn't need to let someone ruin tons of games before you just get rid of them.
Edark
almost 9 years

mist says


Edark says


mist says

In fact, you can just ban him, instead of using technicalities in the rules to protect people who belong on Stormfront.

We do have the rules for a reason, yes. It sounds to me like you don't KNOW what that reason is.


You're asking me to break the rules to ban someone since I dont like them. I cant do that.

Or well technically I could, but for obvious reasons I wont.


No, I'm asking you to gain an understanding of what rules are and aren't for since you seem to lack it.

Here, lemme give you an example.

I used to have a gamethrow alt where I would speak only Japanese gibberish. After I got reported for it once and devante gave me a trolling vio, he messaged the account and just said "You're obviously a troll, if you get reported for this again I'm just skipping to banning you".

Is that in the rules? No. Was he right to do that? Yeah, absolutely.


Technically you could argue its in the rules since he could just looked through your games and determine it was a troll alt thus eligible for multiple violations instantly(due to game violations like trolling/GT/GRS being treated and handed out on a game by game basis.
Rutab
almost 9 years
Why was Devante right to do that lmfao

edit: not talking about anything you're arguing here, besides the fact that Devante wasnt right to do that
Edark
almost 9 years

mist says

Reasons we have rules with a stacking violation system:
-So that users who may not have known better aren't banned for first offenses.
-To provide multiple chances for otherwise positive members of the community to improve their behavior.
-To not take severe action against rare offenders.

NOT reasons we have rules with a stacking violation system:
-To allow users who exist to be vitriolic to get away with a certain amount of spew before they're banned.
-To maximize the amount of trolling a user can do.
-To keep neo-nazis on the site as long as possible.


Indeed, but to avoid bias you cant ban them before they have had their fair share chances to improve like any other user. The amount of chances is the same for anyone or else it would be quite unfair. Since this is his first harassment violation no one can 100% say that his behavior cant improve to the better regardless of what opinion they may have shown.

Banning people outright since I personally think he wont improve is subjective way to moderate and a cause of lot of modabuse which is not a very good idea.
deletedalmost 9 years

Edark says


mist says

In fact, you can just ban him, instead of using technicalities in the rules to protect people who belong on Stormfront.

We do have the rules for a reason, yes. It sounds to me like you don't KNOW what that reason is.


You're asking me to break the rules to ban someone since I dont like them. I cant do that.

Or well technically I could, but for obvious reasons I wont.


No, I'm asking you to gain an understanding of what rules are and aren't for since you seem to lack it.

Here, lemme give you an example.

I used to have a gamethrow alt where I would speak only Japanese gibberish. After I got reported for it once and devante gave me a trolling vio, he messaged the account and just said "You're obviously a troll, if you get reported for this again I'm just skipping to banning you".

Is that in the rules? No. Was he right to do that? Yeah, absolutely.
deletedalmost 9 years
Reasons we have rules with a stacking violation system:
-So that users who may not have known better aren't banned for first offenses.
-To provide multiple chances for otherwise positive members of the community to improve their behavior.
-To not take severe action against rare offenders.

NOT reasons we have rules with a stacking violation system:
-To allow users who exist to be vitriolic to get away with a certain amount of spew before they're banned.
-To maximize the amount of trolling a user can do.
-To keep neo-nazis on the site as long as possible.
deletedalmost 9 years
Amen, lets ban this dude, I'm sure glad my favorite website is on the right side of history.
Edark
almost 9 years

mist says

In fact, you can just ban him, instead of using technicalities in the rules to protect people who belong on Stormfront.

We do have the rules for a reason, yes. It sounds to me like you don't KNOW what that reason is.


You're asking me to break the rules to ban someone since I dont like them. I cant do that.

Or well technically I could, but for obvious reasons I wont.
deletedalmost 9 years
In fact, you can just ban him, instead of using technicalities in the rules to protect people who belong on Stormfront.

We do have the rules for a reason, yes. It sounds to me like you don't KNOW what that reason is.