They are absolutely blank about it. Any person is not allowed to force nl on meteor day if lynching gives them a chance to win. Because NL= confirmed loss. This moderator does not understand the simple thing that he can't know for sure if the person being voted was town. If he wanted to lynch the other guy he should have convinced the other person to vote his way. He is not allowed to force NL and confirm the loss for both parties. Else town will just force NL by saying that 2 different people have 2 different fos. This was clearly resolved by the earlier by each admin. How could you let the new moderators handle this without him knowing the rules.
Just clarify if the moderators judgement is correct or not. If it is then you know what is allowed. It literally means that players are allowed to split votes on MYLO in a meteor.
What if the person getting lynched was mafia? This new moderator just looks at it from a rookie point of view. He is being biased towards the town win scenario. Since the person being voted was town he is saying he was allowed to force NL. He should look at it from a neutral point of view and should judge without knowing what alignment was being lynched.
The idea of meteor is to stop people from choosing no one, choosing someone who can't die. If both sides are choosing an action, there shouldn't be any meteor.
Felons, the problem is that what you said is nowhere to be seen documented and isnt followed
deletedover 8 years
doc has plenty of reason to exist besides injecting auto-losses into meteor nights btw
deletedover 8 years
ur stance is wrong. again, the doc action in and of itself forces meteor. there is no world in which that is not throwing. mafia hits it, u lose. mafia hits cop and ur not on him, u don't lose. simple.
cry all u want about unfairness, but that's how it works. doc is the final arbiter in forcing meteor.
1. Doc has the right to save the clear. Otherwise, why does doctor exist? Every save in any situation can be negated by mafia going for the save over and over again (they obviously would only do this if there was no investigative role) if the doctor loses this right that is fundemental to the role itself.
2. Mafia has the right to kill any clear, even if it doesn't put them in autoloss. This includes even if it's a doc save and they don't have autoloss. They obviously won't kill a clear if it puts them in autoloss.
A fine debate, I obviously side with 1 but some people side with 2
meteors only need to be refunded if the mafia force nk on meteor night intentionally and were not in auto loss if they killed in which case the mafia gets a GT vio and the game gets refunded
or if a group of town members force meteor because they don't want to play the game and the mafia member lightly pushes for lynching to continue the game in which case the instigators of the town meteor would get a GT vio and the game gets refunded.
meteor refund and meteor laws aren't hard to grasp and comprehend and it's amazing you guys spent 10 pages trying arguing it
1. A draw is a loss still so those people are dumb 2. Yeah it's difficult and needs to be looked into, there are a lot of situations. I can try an algorithim for it later
sorry, that post made no sense cuz I thought of the problem, then I thought of the way of fixing the problem at the end, so I put a solution to a problem I said there was but didn't identify, so heh, oops. So just ignore the "difficult to enforce" part.
in all honesty tho, that's a solution, it's better than the current way, I still think making it clear that doc saving a clear is playing towards their win condition, and forcing mafia to kill for doc is a better solution, but its still a little difficult to enforce because even if mafia will ALWAYS get the GT vio for hitting cop in that situation. Then you'd just have to redo the refund rules that if mafia do hit the clear save, then the game will get refunded.
Giga - your first argument is strong but not entirely valid, players are doing that already even without getting refunds, they force meteors just because they value draws more than a loss
your second argument is completely invalid. lets say there is a 10 player game, there is only 1 mafia alive and 2 of the dead mafias are nothing to blame for. the last standing mafia forces a meteor by accident (lets say you looked at the game and ruled that it was an accident), now you will rule that its not a refund? why would both mafias not get a refund when the last standing mafia lost the game by his negligence? there is a rule "isp by negligence" and such accidents should always be ruled as "isp by negligence"
deletedover 8 years
sure mafia bully a kill, but their action in meteor night isn't literally only an instrument to end the game. cry all u want, but the second the doc saves he's only saving to potentially throw the game
It's the mafia's burden, not the doctors. The role of the doctor is to save. DOCTOR IS THERE TO SAVE THE CLEAR, IF MAFIA DON'T HAVE AUTOLOSS BY KILLING OUTSIDE OF THE CLEAR THEN THEY DON'T HAVE TO GO FOR THE CLEAR
at the end of the day the mafia are playing towards their win condition by going for a kill & continuing the game.
the doctor is not because he's going for a save, in the meteor night, which if it happens will end the game no matter what.
it might not be gentlemen-like play by the mafia for continuously going on who the doctor is saving from day 1. but it's still playing towards a duel win condition (the continuation of the game)
deletedover 8 years
isn't it a simple solution, hedger? doc-saving on meteor night is like self-orcing or something
Meteor rules
