Epicmafia

Should hip-firing be GT?

over 9 years

This is not a complaint thread.

No mods have been injured in the making of this thread.

Parental discretion advised: contains gun violence.

I originally filed an appeal against Mist, mistakenly believing that hip-firing being GT was the precedent ruling. I had this mistaken assumption because the last time I was active on this site, that was the case.

It is now clear that my actual appeal is against the current precedent. Mist was merely basing the verdict on current precedent, and has made no mistake in handling the original report

To me this seems like a very black/white scenario. Shooting a gun for the sake of shooting a gun is a clear indication that you do not care about the outcome of the game. If you cared about the outcome of the game, you would try to shoot in such a way that benefits town.

The current precedent treats hip-firing as trolling. Is there any merit in this? Is someone who randomly fires a gun trying to antagonize anyone, or is it that they do not care about winning?

Helsinki has taken the bold stand against the current precedent, and I imagine that moderators are discussing this among themselves before the next vote is cast.

Lets help them make the right decision. >>>>>>>>>

Should hip-firing (shooting with no reads) be considered Game-throwing?

Yes

deletedover 9 years

hipfiring in YYC a second into the day as sheriff is a better example of hipfiring = gt in that case. a&d is more situational though.

vilden

over 9 years

the general argument is: hipfiring cannot possibly be advantageous. It can be as i've just proven (mafia is narrowed). so a punishment of automatic GT after a hipfire is getting weaker

Aesop

over 9 years

grudgelynching also plays to your wincon because it narrows down the mafia

deletedover 9 years

vilden says

i just said hipfiring in a way plays to your wincon cuz it narrows down the mafia

so does grudge voting

deletedover 9 years

helsinki says

Devante says

helsinki says

keri says

no. giving someone a violation only based on the action of hipfiring is freaking stupid. other actions should also be looked @ and also previous vios ofc

If he shot him for being pranay, that's grudge shooting which is a game throw. If he shot pranay and said nothing, it's trolling

i'm going a step further and saying it's gamethrowing even if it wasn't because he's pranay solely because there will be cases where you don't know the intention of the shot, however if you shoot someone without reads
and if you've ever played that sheriff blacksmith setup with Glacial you'll see him encourage people to do it nearly every single game. You're not playing to your win condition because you've only got a 3/8 chance of hitting mafia combined with a 2/8 chance of hitting the cop or the bs. You literally cannot have any intention of winning by hipfiring in that scenario, which is why it should be gamethrowing regardless of what you say your reason for the shot was.

Playing badly or sub optimally isn't game throwing. Why did you give zovea your password?

but... we all know fancy pants meta is destroying the integrity of the site...

vilden

over 9 years

i just said hipfiring in a way plays to your wincon cuz it narrows down the mafia

deletedover 9 years

vilden says

ya so shooting someone after a 2-3 min opener read, that someone was town. you've narrowed down ppl. mafia is easier to find by process. in a way it plays to your wincon

I think people are confused because they have absolutely no clue what side of this argument you're on

deletedover 9 years

let's even go and lets say you hipfire in A&D day two, what if you hipfired the person mafia was just about to random guilty?

What if that's the person the cop had an inno on, so they were potentially a clear?

What if that person is the person cop was about to guilty nearly clearing the cop.

do you understand how it's going against your wincon now?

Togepi

over 9 years

vilden says

ya so shooting someone after a 2-3 min opener read, that someone was town. you've narrowed down ppl. mafia is easier to find by process

This is about hipfiring with no reads.

vilden

over 9 years

ya so shooting someone after a 2-3 min opener read, that someone was town. you've narrowed down ppl. mafia is easier to find by process. in a way it plays to your wincon

deletedover 9 years

every single hipfire in a comp game is gamethrowing, i don't care what the violation is in red hearts.

deletedover 9 years

you can't say every hipfire is gamethrowing stop saying that

deletedover 9 years

Devante says

helsinki says

keri says

no. giving someone a violation only based on the action of hipfiring is freaking stupid. other actions should also be looked @ and also previous vios ofc

If he shot him for being pranay, that's grudge shooting which is a game throw. If he shot pranay and said nothing, it's trolling

i'm going a step further and saying it's gamethrowing even if it wasn't because he's pranay solely because there will be cases where you don't know the intention of the shot, however if you shoot someone without reads
and if you've ever played that sheriff blacksmith setup with Glacial you'll see him encourage people to do it nearly every single game. You're not playing to your win condition because you've only got a 3/8 chance of hitting mafia combined with a 2/8 chance of hitting the cop or the bs. You literally cannot have any intention of winning by hipfiring in that scenario, which is why it should be gamethrowing regardless of what you say your reason for the shot was.

Playing badly or sub optimally isn't game throwing. Why did you give zovea your password?

deletedover 9 years

vilden says

I think generally everyone thinks a rapid shot is going against wincon so it's GT. can anyone think of a reason why it IS playing to your wincon? Twist hinted to it earlier, "Shooting someone quick then tryharding the rest of the game to find maf"

wtf?

deletedover 9 years

helsinki says

keri says

no. giving someone a violation only based on the action of hipfiring is freaking stupid. other actions should also be looked @ and also previous vios ofc

If he shot him for being pranay, that's grudge shooting which is a game throw. If he shot pranay and said nothing, it's trolling

i'm going a step further and saying it's gamethrowing even if it wasn't because he's pranay solely because there will be cases where you don't know the intention of the shot, however if you shoot someone without reads
and if you've ever played that sheriff blacksmith setup with Glacial you'll see him encourage people to do it nearly every single game. You're not playing to your win condition because you've only got a 3/8 chance of hitting mafia combined with a 2/8 chance of hitting the cop or the bs. You literally cannot have any intention of winning by hipfiring in that scenario, which is why it should be gamethrowing regardless of what you say your reason for the shot was.

deletedover 9 years

of course not bill, but in that case a trolling vio is more appropriate than a gt vio. and hipfiring is something that should be more game-by-game and not have a strict 'oh ok you hipfired so it's an auto trolling vio'.

Satan

over 9 years

helsinki says

Look at these forum posters just disagreeing with me because I am a moderator. They don't know how hard it is. They shouldn't even get posting privileges until they've walked an internet mile in my shoes

have i walked an internet mile in your shoes

Togepi

over 9 years

Satan says

Togepi says

Satan says

Sims says

https://epicmafia.com/user/398729#/ if you tell me who this is i'll give you head

wow good question.

i think togepi might be onto something

Right? Where the eff is my reward?

i think sims is looking for a more complete answer

I just want him to love me. :(

vilden

over 9 years

I think generally everyone thinks a rapid shot is going against wincon so it's GT. can anyone think of a reason why it IS playing to your wincon? Twist hinted to it earlier, "Shooting someone quick then tryharding the rest of the game to find maf"

deletedover 9 years

Look at these forum posters just disagreeing with me because I am a moderator. They don't know how hard it is. They shouldn't even get posting privileges until they've walked an internet mile in my shoes

Satan

over 9 years

Togepi says

Satan says

Sims says

https://epicmafia.com/user/398729#/ if you tell me who this is i'll give you head

wow good question.

i think togepi might be onto something

Right? Where the eff is my reward?

i think sims is looking for a more complete answer

deletedover 9 years

Trolling in situations without implied grudge or for no game-related reasons
Instant GT if theres grudge involved

deletedover 9 years

keri says

helsinki says

keri says

helsinki says

keri says

no. giving someone a violation only based on the action of hipfiring is freaking stupid. other actions should also be looked @ and also previous vios ofc

If he shot him for being pranay, that's grudge shooting which is a game throw. If he shot pranay and said nothing, it's trolling

yes he wanted to antagonize pranay. jesus

I think removing a player from the game goes a step beyond antagonizing

he did it for the lolz not b/c he had the intention of not winning the game

Seems like you think game throwing is specifically trying to lose rather than just not trying to win or prioritizing something else above winning. Is that fair to say?

Sims

over 9 years

you are the 30mph to slow's 15

Togepi

over 9 years

Satan says

Sims says

https://epicmafia.com/user/398729#/ if you tell me who this is i'll give you head

wow good question.

i think togepi might be onto something

Right? Where the eff is my reward?