THE TITLE IS WRONG AND I CANT EDIT IT. IM ASKING FOR PROMOTING OTHER SETUPS IN REDHEARTS, JUST SO FP/CLASSIC AREN'T THE MOST PLAYED SETUPS AS THEY PROMOTE LAZY MAFIA.
Reasons why they should NOT BE THE DEFAULT SETUP OF MAIN LOBBY:
promote NLing D1 for insta lylo
promote following clears mindlessly
are overly reliant on mechanics instead of on actual scumhunting
are extremely luck based and promote passive town play which leads to all other setups have higher maf win ratios
coinflips are bad
promote CC fights instead of actual behaviour reading
reliance on swing elements that make the whole game a farce (FP in particular)
inflate bad players' win ratios making them think they are better than they really are
Yes, that's exactly my point. Im not ok with trainging people being rewarded the same for p[laying a 5 minute FP game while I play a 90 minute one.
Comp being separate allowed for separate pie charts so it was never an issue. Now that the lobbies are merged this needs to be addressed if Red hearts are supposed to 'train' people for gold hearts.
deletedalmost 10 years
The purpose of training may at one point have been to get players prepared for comp, but it has evolved to be a makeshift intermediate lobby, which in my opinion better suits the community.
With this in mind, banning fp and class, the top two most popular set ups on EM, one that has players revisiting regularly, is not the solution. Some people enjoy the fact that achievements are the Trophy equivelents of training. PLUS, if what you say is true, then not all achievements can be earn anyway just by playing in ranked.
deletedalmost 10 years
Maybe the purpose of red hearts wasn't lost, but rather evolved to better fit the desires and wishes of the player base?
If players want to join comp, they will do so on their own. You can't force them, and you won't convince them comp players are compassionate by banning their favorite set ups.
For the record, a full-out ban of FP probably isn't the answer, but there's an issue and there needs to be a fix.
deletedalmost 10 years
lol so itg is just butthurt about fancy pants players who have more points than him on Epicmafia.com
its ridiculous
Twelve, on the other hand, cares about other players who are unable to choose between good and evil setups. He claims he is competent, as epicmafia-veteran, to help them decide.
Sigh, you're missing my point entirely. The ranked system is meant to progressively ready a player for competitive play. That's why red hearts were originally in the "Training lobby". The way the "Training lobby" was being used meant that it was a separate community, a large portion of which didn't ever want to venture into comp. Acknowledging this fact, the lobby piecharts were split. (So that training-accrued points didn't count for comp-accrued points.) However, due to the lobby merge, that is once again an issue. I've seen most of the casual players play less mindless setups like o2r or DLYG all the time, so it's not like FP is the only setup they enjoy. The /real/ issue that we're resolving here is that when a new player joins the site they're immediately drowned in FP. They (of course) get used to FP and accept it as the norm. What you're missing is that humans are creatures of habit. And /a lot of them/ artificially have the habit of playing FP thrown onto them.
deletedalmost 10 years
What is the purpose of red heart games if they are not there for new players to get their feet wet in playing semi-serious games with set ups with they are familiar with?
All of the "play it for fun" = play it unranked arguments need to stop.
People don't play seriously in unranked. Suicides happen freely. No penalty for bad behavior. And getting points is obviously part of the fun as well, in the same way that getting a trophy is part of the reason people play competitive.
I am not advocating a 100% site ban on FP or classic, I want it to be limited to unranked because if players truly played it 'for fun', then there would be nothing wrong with it in unranked.
Having ranked games of FP and Classic promotes an unhealthy meta. It also doesn't properly equip players with the skills necessary for comp.
It's like trying to build a house where your foundation is pizza. IT WONT WORK.
You can play them, just on unranked. Why would that be any different if you only played for fun?
Smorlicious then please tell me why u cant play FP and Classic on unranked if its solely for fun?
I am not ok with you earning points and achievements on 5 minute games vs having to play 90 minute long ones to earn the same amount of pts/achievements/pie chart.
Let people play what they want geez. There will always be people complaining about the most popular setup. After banning FP, people will complain about VDLI or something.
deletedalmost 10 years
The only reason why ppl don't play other setups couse they don't fill, couse other ppl want to play fp. And ppl who are tired of FP are the ppl who have been in EM for a while, and browse forums. So basicly while we are discussing this, other less known ppl are enjoying fp.
deletedalmost 10 years
Imagine if the arguments used here to ban fp and classic were used in a petition to ban all pop music.
"My opinion says the only music that should be worthy for the radio is music that is to my standards and taste, and somewhat meaningful. Pop music is unintelligent and does not require someone to think as much, and does not meet my standard for good music. Therefore it should be banned from being played on the radio, even though countless people enjoy it! People shouldn't stick with what they enjoy, they need to experiment and try new things! Banning pop music is the only way to get them to try new genres. There's nothing wrong with this, they can still listen to it in the privacy of their own homes! People totally won't find other ways to listen to pop music..."
Not exactly the same, but similar concept.
deletedalmost 10 years
The point of my argument isn't to try to defend the honor of Fancy Pants and Classic by somehow trying to convince you that it is a wonderful set up.
The reason why I disagree with a decision to blacklist fancy pants has everything to do with the fact it would be banned not for being an unbalanced or bad set up, but simply because "some people don't like it."
I don't think it's fair at all for people to have their favorite set up blacklisted and banned from being played in ranked simply because a few people think it's a waste of time and doesn't help a player grow.
Why are you assuming players who join this site are here to being mega comp players? Maybe they just want to play classic ranked games all day? Why is it that we're going to ban not one of, but THE most popular set up based on the fact some people find it unintelligent.
IF you blacklist it, people will leave, and those remaining will continue to play other mindless set ups in ranked, or will play classic/fp in unranked. This will only intimidate players from joining ranked games (in a similar way some are to comp.) when they see the only red heart games played are hard ones.
Competition games are the ones meant to be used for scumhunting and serious play. Red heart games are reserved for learning to play and playing lighter and quicker games. Don't mess up the balance. If people want to play different set ups, they will.
I think it's kinda funny people think the site is on the brink of death. The only thing this site has an issue with is skill level of players. (And number of comp players) More games are played these days than there used to be.
BV sucks because people will lynch guilties (like they used to when BV was standard) LOBL sucks cuz PRs will claim as PR or claim too early O2R is good but unpopular/scumsided STBS will end up 65/35 in red hearts VDLI too boring
The people that are familiar with FP/the ones that make the tables will immediately attempt to recreate the setup. However, if FP/no varients were allowed to be played, people would still join games. (Although, since people like things that are familiar, if they saw an FP game or another simplistic setup they'd probably leave and join that.)
