Epicmafia

Training Lobby Change Proposals

over 10 years

Hi training lobby. I haven’t properly introduced myself here but you’ll know TheBrontosaurus well as your lobby owner. One of the things we want to improve on EpicMafia considerably is the harmony and synergy of other lobbies, and give players old and new many different ventures on the site.

One of the stumbling blocks that we have is finding a way to keep training running the way it is, whilst also not making it exploited by point farming with new users who wish to play the game.

I’ve made a thread in competitive which I hope you take time to look at too which has more ideas that can make their way to this lobby, it can be found here.

https://epicmafia.com/topic/63209

So what are the ideas that we have for training?

1) Lobby rename

One issue that’s easy to notice with training is that it has lost its meaning for most of the players in this lobby. We don’t wish to splinter another lobby for new players only, but would like to rename it to something more appropriate. At the moment the leading name is Casual, but I realize that there is an online stigma behind this. If you can think of better names, please let us know.

2) 10K points cap

One of the problems with training is users using it to farm up points. There’s been a lot of aggressive suggestions on how to fix this, one method we had very long ago was forcing people to join comp lobby once they reached a certain threshold. We do not want that to happen again, but we also do not want point farming by playing with newer users.

What does this mean if implemented? It means that once you reach 10000 points in Training/New name pending, you won’t earn more points for future wins you have. We think this is a generous amount to deter point-farming, but you are still fully free to play in the lobby unrestricted if you wish. Stats and other achievements will still be viable and tracked.

3) Greater input with moderators

One bias we notice is how most new moderators are picked from competitive. We realize that most mods have been picked from the comp lobby in the past, however we certainly want to embrace new variation when we look for new moderators in the certain future. If you’re ever interested in being one, feel free to PM an application for it to be reviewed.

Finishing notes

I realize this might look like a forced attempt to boost competitive player numbers. Partially, it is, but I hope you check out the comp thread too if you would like to see more information.There are news ideas in that thread that will be added to training too. Please give any feedback you have, thanks again.

MafiaGod

over 10 years

1.) Name change it to whatever, as long as it still functions the way it should.

2.) You will lose a lot of players. Considering the loss of players with the other recent changes you made I would wait a year to do this. BUT I do not think you should do it at all. People want to get into games quickly and not wait around forever. That is what is so great about playing games in Training. Take that away and you will lose people UNTIL the new Main lobby is filled with enough people. You won't stop point farming. That will happen anywhere; in any lobby and with any setup anyone is good at so long as it fills. I support Kristy ... I hate 45 minute scum hunting games it is a waste of time. IF the point won matched the time, I would consider it. like normal points at 15 minutes. double at 30, triple at 45 minutes. Still 45 minute games as bored blue is boring as ***. [Hey good job on the swear filter btw, about time lucid, I need help I cannot control myself. XD] We like to join other games quickly enough to rotate through roles. Any cap just divides the site and then games are not filling. Waiting around for games to fill is hard enough; waiting for BS games to end = site death.

3.) AS for Mods. I am just not going to comment on this.

deletedover 10 years

Yeah, but the problem can basically be summarized as follows: 1. Comp lobby people are ***. 2. Training Lobby people are *** awesome. ---- Please stop trying to start a war against training lobby.

Kristy

over 10 years

COMP is stupid. I can't get on every day to play every heart and therefore can never win. And what's the point in playing if you can't ever win? It's for tryhards. What those of us who know what we are doing want is a lobby where we can play "seriously", for hearts/points, without n00bs. We have no interest in scumhunting out 45 minutes for someone to veg right at the end, or waiting 20 minutes to start a game and an idiot n00b suiciding n1 because they're blue. We just wanna play. Fairly. Without n00bs. We don't want to "teach" and "train".

gistofeverything

over 10 years

Is it possible to just remove points altogether? Like I know they're necessary for competitive placing and such, but pointfarming just seems to be inevitable.

deletedover 10 years

Not letting me play in training won't make me migrate to comp. it will help me migrate away from this site lol. Comp players are to serious. No thanks. This site is burning into a bunch of *** rules. And yalls hard on for comp lobby is ridiculous. Is it that serious.

Jupiter

over 10 years

Gible says

A lot of people here have complained that the reason they don't want to go to the competitive lobby is because of them being "rude," or setups that they don't understand. That's one of the points of this...If people go over to the competitive lobby, then instead of one group of people there'd be a variety.

Also, if you don't like the setups in the comp lobby, then you make new ones. Therefore more setups for the competitive lobby, and more setups that more people like. That's what this was intended to do, I'm pretty sure.

You're exactly right. The competitive lobby doesn't have to be a lobby where everyone has a stick up their *** and takes the game too seriously. We're trying to get away from that stigma with renaming it, and hopefully bringing in training players will do that too.

deletedover 10 years

EmmerrLouise says

Because as it stands no one who stays in training is getting any 'practice' at competitive gaming - it might ease the transition into comp lobby after experience with gold heart games in general, the rewards for playing them (trophies, tokens) etc.

agree with bringing it back but it needs some changes to make it different from the competitive competition. firstly, get rid of trophies for the training lobby competition and make tokens the prize. 30 for 1st place, 20 for 2nd place and 10 for 3rd. secondly, limit the amount of setups that can be used int the competition (I think 4 is fair, one setup picked each by the top 3 players in the last round and the 4th setup picked by the moderators/community consensus).

also having a cut off point for points earned in ranked games in the training lobby is a ludicrous idea. the members are the important people here, without active members, this site dies. if people want to play terrible setups like fancy pants all day then so be it; I don't see what impact it has on the site. people have already said on this thread that they are against the cut off point idea, so putting it into practice could potentially drive those and other members away from the site, which isn't good. I understand that you are trying to encourage players to play in the competitive lobby but you can't force them. those who want to play competitively or want to improve their game will play there and those who just want to play for the fun of it will stay in the training lobby. let people find their place.

deletedover 10 years

A lot of people here have complained that the reason they don't want to go to the competitive lobby is because of them being "rude," or setups that they don't understand. That's one of the points of this...If people go over to the competitive lobby, then instead of one group of people there'd be a variety.

Also, if you don't like the setups in the comp lobby, then you make new ones. Therefore more setups for the competitive lobby, and more setups that more people like. That's what this was intended to do, I'm pretty sure.

deletedover 10 years

Can we just nuke all the mods and admins into radioactive ash, then jump in a time machine to two years ago when epicmafia.com was in it's golden age?

TheVigil

over 10 years

Satan says

Satan says

Instead of casual lobby, maybe the starter lobby? casual makes it seem like no one would take it seriously

quoted from my first post as I think starter lobby is the best name for it.

Has a nice ring to it. I like Comp being called Standard

Satan

over 10 years

Satan says

Instead of casual lobby, maybe the starter lobby? casual makes it seem like no one would take it seriously

quoted from my first post as I think starter lobby is the best name for it.

TheVigil

over 10 years

Also I don't really see the problem with point farming in training. It's not really harming anything as players don't get trophies for points in training. You could argue it gives an unfair representation of that players skill, but at the end of the day we shouldn't judge a players skill by how many digits they have next to their score. we should judge them by their in-game performance.

TheVigil

over 10 years

TweIve says

TheVigil says

EmmerrLouise says

I am sceptical that it'd turn out like that. I think it'd be the same as training is now - some players preferring to play FP, cocos etc (which is absolutely fine) so a lobby merge may not necessarily encourage comp games to be played. Idk - this is one of those things that needs testing.

Exactly, Most people play in training because they don't care about the competition. Merging lobbies most likely wont change this. If anything it will affect the competition because there will be less gold heart games.

effect* and worst case scenario there will be exactly the same amount of comp games.

That would be bad then if there is the same number of comp games then red heart games will suffer.

TweIve

over 10 years

TheVigil says

EmmerrLouise says

I am sceptical that it'd turn out like that. I think it'd be the same as training is now - some players preferring to play FP, cocos etc (which is absolutely fine) so a lobby merge may not necessarily encourage comp games to be played. Idk - this is one of those things that needs testing.

Exactly, Most people play in training because they don't care about the competition. Merging lobbies most likely wont change this. If anything it will affect the competition because there will be less gold heart games.

effect* and worst case scenario there will be exactly the same amount of comp games.

TheVigil

over 10 years

EmmerrLouise says

I am sceptical that it'd turn out like that. I think it'd be the same as training is now - some players preferring to play FP, cocos etc (which is absolutely fine) so a lobby merge may not necessarily encourage comp games to be played. Idk - this is one of those things that needs testing.

Exactly, Most people play in training because they don't care about the competition. Merging lobbies most likely wont change this. If anything it will affect the competition because there will be less gold heart games.

EmmerrLouise

over 10 years

I am sceptical that it'd turn out like that. I think it'd be the same as training is now - some players preferring to play FP, cocos etc (which is absolutely fine) so a lobby merge may not necessarily encourage comp games to be played. Idk - this is one of those things that needs testing.

TweIve

over 10 years

EmmerrLouise says

I feel like the OP implies anyone over 10k will/have farm/ed for points. And you do realise that, with the point cap, anyone over 10k will just start playing FP, cocos, classic and other 'training lobby setups' they like in comp lobby.

That's the aim of this; if they're in comp lobby they have a much higher likelihood of being curious and joining gold heart games. Moreover; if there's stuff that training players are familiar with in the comp lobby they're more likely to stay playing the stuff they're familiar to. And when enough players are playing red heart games in comp a fair amount of them will join the gold heart games, which is the same theory as training comp.

Xplicitable

over 10 years

I am yet convinced that point farming is as big of an issue as made out to be.

Capping points does not solve the issue of point farming. Point farming will always be around as long as points are on the site. Points are a measure of time played more than skill. Most people would say so. Most people would also say trophies are a far more accurate measure of skill, combined with a view at that user's role stats and most played setups. As many have pointed out above, restricting point farming in the Training Lobby would only see it migrate to another lobby. This is not the solution to this problem, and frankly I don't think it isn't one. Like everything, it's superficial. It has no meaning to it. It's unreasonable to spend time arguing over the manipulation of points when it boils down to a number. There is no advantage to farming points past 1500 anyway.

deletedover 10 years

Trepur349 says

atm most point farming happens in the smaller lobbies anyway (ie reverse lobby), so why limit this too training only?

hey we're just a circlejerk lobby with two sides that hate each other. :')

crywolf87

over 10 years

My issue is that this is a game. It is supposed to be fun. I find training to be fun. Comp players play setups I do not enjoy and are very rude half the time. I do not care about trophies or gold hearts. I want a place where I can play for points but not be scolded if I don't make the move one or two people think is correct. I want to enjoy myself and not be worried about making someone angry over a game. Make that lobby for experienced players and I'll be there, but until then, training lobby is the lobby for me.

Ella

over 10 years

no b/c when there was training comp it just incentivized people to stay in training because training comp was just as good as comp, it was just "more friendly" etc etc

EmmerrLouise

over 10 years

Because as it stands no one who stays in training is getting any 'practice' at competitive gaming - it might ease the transition into comp lobby after experience with gold heart games in general, the rewards for playing them (trophies, tokens) etc.

Ella

over 10 years

EmmerrLouise says

Bumpers, is it worth retrying the Training Lobby competition? Introduces the 'competitive' element without thrusting comp lobby itself upon the training lobby?

how does that change the lack of activity in comp though? the changes being proposed are supposed to integrate the two communities more or smth and training comp never helped that

Ash0wns

over 10 years

Those "easy" setups are fun. Not those comp setups.

nice

over 10 years

Trepur349 says

atm most point farming happens in the smaller lobbies anyway (ie reverse lobby), so why limit this too training only?

it's not literal pointfarming. they're referring to how most training lobby players will play easy setups (classic, fp, coco's) just to get more points.