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PAM AND ANNAJANE SHOULD BE DEMODDED

WildWalrus
about 8 years

PER INFORMATION FOUND IN THIS THREAD:
https://epicmafia.com/topic/76875

BEFORE WE BEGIN, WE MUST EXPLORE WHY THIS IS AN IMPORTANT ISSUE.

  1. THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN MODS AND THE COMMUNITY IS ONE BUILT UPON TRUST. - MUCH LIKE POLICE OFFICERS AND THE COMMUNITIES THEY ARE TASKED WITH KEEPING SAFE, THERE NEEDS TO BE A CERTAIN LEVEL OF MUTUAL TRUST BETWEEN THE TWO PARTIES.

  2. THE COMMUNITY IS HOSTILE TOWARDS THE MODS. TYING IN WITH #1, THE COMMUNITY IS LARGELY HOSTILE TOWARDS THE MOD TEAM AS A WHOLE. THIS IS MOSTLY DUE TO THE ABUSES OF THE PREVIOUS MOD TEAM, AND REFLECTS UNFAIRLY ON MOST OF THE CURRENT MODS AS A WHOLE. HOWEVER THIS SIMPLY UNDERLINES HOW IMPORTANT IT IS TO RE-ESTABLISH LOST TRUST.

  3. THE COMMUNITY RELIES ON MODERATORS TO BE IMPARTIAL, FAIR, AND TO UPHOLD THE RULES TO THE BEST OF THEIR ABILITIES. THIS IS ALREADY DIFFICULT TO DO WHEN YOU DON'T HAVE THE TRUST OF THE COMMUNITY. REGARDLESS, THE COMMUNITY RELIES ON THE MOD TEAM TO FACILITATE A POSITIVE ENVIRONMENT FOR ALL. THE REASON PEOPLE CHOOSE TO LEAVE COMMUNITIES IS WHEN THE PEOPLE TASKED WITH PROTECTING THOSE COMMUNITIES ARE THE ONES WHO MAKE IT TOXIC.

WE HAVE ALL SEEN THE RECENT BACKLASH AGAINST POLICE OFFICERS WHO ABUSE THEIR POWER BECAUSE THEY NEED NOT ANSWER FOR IT. THIS IS A STANDARD WE NEED TO AVOID.

SO WHY SHOULD WE DEMOD ANNAJANE AND SIMPLYPAM?
ASIDE FROM THE FACTS LINKED AT THE TOP OF THE OP, LET'S REVIEW THE FACTS.

  1. IT HAS BEEN CLEARLY ESTABLISHED BEYOND A SHADOW OF A DOUBT THAT ANNAJANE AND SIMPLY PAM HAVE BEEN CAUGHT ABUSING THEIR MOD POWER. HOWEVER, THIS ISN'T REASON ENOUGH TO DEMOD SOMEONE. SOMETIMES MODS MAKE MISTAKES, EVERYONE LOSES THEIR COOL AT ONE POINT OR ANOTHER. THEN WHY IS WALRUS ADVOCATING FOR THE DEMODDING OF THESE TWO CORRUPT MODS?

  2. ANNAJANE AND SIMPLYPAM HAVE BEEN CAUGHT COLLUDING TO GIVE VIOLATIONS TO PEOPLE THEY DON'T LIKE. - PROVED IN THE THREAD LINKED AT THE TOP. THIS IS EXTREMELY PROBLEMATIC, AS IT IS AKIN TO A POLICE OFFICER ARRESTING A PERSON THEY DON'T LIKE ON A BOGUS CHARGE, AND A JUDGE COLLUDING WITH THAT POLICE OFFICER TO GIVE THEM THAT VIOLATION. THIS IS DOWNRIGHT DISGUSTING; IT BETRAYS THE TRUST THE COMMUNITY HAS IN THE MOD TEAM, AND DESTROYS THE CREDIBILITY OF THE REPORTS THESE SPECIFIC MODERATORS HANDLE AND THE VERDICTS OF THE MODERATOR TEAM HANDLES IN GENERAL.

  3. WE NEED TO SET AN EXAMPLE AND A STANDARD. SIMPLY GIVING PAM AND ANNAJANE A SLAP ON THE WRIST SERVES ONLY TO FURTHER ALIENATE THE MOD TEAM FROM THE COMMUNITY. THE COMMUNITY NEEDS TO BE SENT A SIGNAL THAT THEY HAVE THE COMMUNITY'S BEST INTERESTS AT HEART, AND PEOPLE WHO THREATEN TO UNDERMINE THAT COMMUNITY WILL NOT BE TOLERATED. WORDS NEED TO BE BACKED BY ACTIONS.

  4. ALLOWING PAM AND ANNA TO WALK AWAY SCOTT FREE SETS A BAD PRECEDENT FOR WHAT IS ACCEPTABLE. EVEN IF THEY "GET A WARNING", THEY HAVEN'T SUFFERED ANY TANGIBLE CONSEQUENCES. THEY DON'T CARE, AND THEY GET THE SMUG SATISFACTION THAT THEY GOT TO ABUSE THEIR POWER ON SOMEONE THEY DIDN'T LIKE. FURTHERMORE, IF WALRUS HADN'T RAISED A CRAPSTORM, WE HAVE NO GUARANTEE THAT THEY WOULD HAVE EVEN BEEN CAUGHT. WE'VE SEEN COUNTLESS EXAMPLES OF MODS GETTING AWAY WITH ABUSING THEIR POWER IN THE PAST.

WE THE COMMUNITY SIMPLY CANNOT STAND FOR THIS TYPE OF ABUSE TO WALK AWAY SCOTT FREE. WE HAVE EMPIRICAL EXAMPLES OF COMMUNITIES DYING BECAUSE THOSE ESTABLISHED IN POWER PLACED THEMSELVES ABOVE THE RULES WHICH THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO ENFORCE. PAM AND ANNA MUST BE DEMODDED FOR THE MOD TEAM TO RESTORE ANY SEMBLANCE OF LEGITIMACY TO ITS NAME AND THE RULES WHICH IT GOVERNS.

F R E E | E P I C | M A F I A

denial
about 8 years

Giga13 says


denial says


Sims says

moderators don't owe anything to people who are consistently toxic and unpleasant. they're volunteer moderators on an Internet website, not employees in a business, workers for the government, or any other analogy that would require them to "act professionally" to rude people


what is "toxic"? being annoying? i mean i don't think hes particularly insulting to anyone other than just being annoying as a gimmick

also, volunteering does not = i get to pick my own rules because i do this for free on an internet website

if lucid doesn't give a crap about his user base being treated like crap, then all for it, have a blast if thats how what you truly believe. thinking that your moderation team should be able to ignore complaints because someone is being rude to them is ridiculous, lol


This wasn't ignored and we haven't been ignoring him, actually

Mod abuse isn't tolerated and when something of this nature happens it's dealt with internally


i wasn't really responding to what happened in this situation, but dwelling deeper into sims post, which basically says "professionalism doesn't really apply here because mods don't owe you anything since they're doing this for free on a website"

also on another note cause i found it amusing (to connor or whoever it was), mods have always been trolling and it wasn't just slowbro. slowbro didn't even really troll, he was just being rude to everyone. if you want examples, you should be find plenty in any thread directed towards antikrist, or when colombe was complaining about the not trophying
Sims
about 8 years
well maybe once you drop the caps lock gimmick and actually make an effort to have a serious discussion with me about transparency, professionalism, and most importantly Forum Moderation, i'd be happy to have the discussion with you. until then i think the answers already given to you are more than sufficient.
WildWalrus
about 8 years

Sims says

as a forum moderator, i try to use my best discretion when deciding if a post should be deleted or not.




REALLY? BECAUSE IT SEEMS LIKE YOUR BEST DISCRETION IS "I DON'T LIKE WHAT HE SAID. DELETE."
ice
about 8 years

denial says

thinking that your moderation team should be able to ignore complaints because someone is being rude to them is ridiculous, lol


is this a genuine post?
Sonrio
about 8 years
I wouldve negged it
Sims
about 8 years
as a forum moderator, i try to use my best discretion when deciding if a post should be deleted or not.
WildWalrus
about 8 years

Sims says

i wasn't responding to you and i deleted your post because it was unnecessarily antagonistic to me when, like i said, i was not responding to you.




WHAT GIVES YOU THE RIGHT TO DELETE SOMEONE'S POST, JUST BECAUSE YOU DON'T LIKE WHAT THEY SAY?
Sims
about 8 years
i wasn't responding to you and i deleted your post because it was unnecessarily antagonistic to me when, like i said, i was not responding to you.
WildWalrus
about 8 years

Sims says



as far as them not owing you guys professionalism, mods will only treat you badly if you treat them badly first.




WE HAVE SHOWN, EMPIRICALLY, THAT IS A BLATANT LIE.

IF YOU DON'T WANT WALRUS TO MAKE A BIG DEAL ABOUT SOMETHING, THEN DON'T START FLINGING CRAP.

YEAH, THE CLAIM IS THAT "STUFF IS DEALT WITH INTERNALLY". WELL IF YOU BOTHERED TO READ THE OP, IT CALLS FOR A LEVEL OF TRANSPARENCY - REGARDLESS OF WHETHER OR NOT IT GETS TAKEN A STEP FURTHER.

WHAT PUNISHMENT ARE THE MODS IN QUESTION RECEIVING? IS THAT PUNISHMENT ENOUGH? THESE ARE A COUPLE OF THE QUESTIONS RAISED IN THE OP WHICH YOU FAILED TO READ.

SERIOUSLY STOP DELETING MY REPLIES AND STOP POSTING IN THIS THREAD IF YOU ARE NOT GOING TO BOTHER READING AT ALL.
Giga13
about 8 years

denial says


Sims says

moderators don't owe anything to people who are consistently toxic and unpleasant. they're volunteer moderators on an Internet website, not employees in a business, workers for the government, or any other analogy that would require them to "act professionally" to rude people


what is "toxic"? being annoying? i mean i don't think hes particularly insulting to anyone other than just being annoying as a gimmick

also, volunteering does not = i get to pick my own rules because i do this for free on an internet website

if lucid doesn't give a crap about his user base being treated like crap, then all for it, have a blast if thats how what you truly believe. thinking that your moderation team should be able to ignore complaints because someone is being rude to them is ridiculous, lol


This wasn't ignored and we haven't been ignoring him, actually

Mod abuse isn't tolerated and when something of this nature happens it's dealt with internally
Sims
about 8 years
other mods already gave an acceptable response in the other thread wildwalrus made. creating a mob mentality demanding for two mods' heads who already have to deal with the admins discussing the issue puts so much unneeded stress on them that they don't deserve. they made the wrong call, it got overturned, and it's in solace and harry's hands now.

as far as them not owing you guys professionalism, mods will only treat you badly if you treat them badly first. it's a mod's job to help the community and make the site as pleasant an experience as possible, but they shouldn't have to sacrifice personal happiness for that. it's why there's such a short mod lifespan and why most mods hate posting on the forums. it's not fun to respond to threads like this in the slightest.
Sims
about 8 years
i don't remember saying half of the things you think i said
denial
about 8 years

Sims says

moderators don't owe anything to people who are consistently toxic and unpleasant. they're volunteer moderators on an Internet website, not employees in a business, workers for the government, or any other analogy that would require them to "act professionally" to rude people


what is "toxic"? being annoying? i mean i don't think hes particularly insulting to anyone other than just being annoying as a gimmick

also, volunteering does not = i get to pick my own rules because i do this for free on an internet website

if lucid doesn't give a crap about his user base being treated like crap, then all for it, have a blast if thats how what you truly believe. thinking that your moderation team should be able to ignore complaints because someone is being rude to them is ridiculous, lol
ChaoticDoom
about 8 years
im down with this
Sonrio
about 8 years
wildwalrus will never be banned under this mod team lol
WildWalrus
about 8 years
GERRY SUGGESTS/JOKES THAT I SHOULD BE A MOD, AND I TELL HIM I DON'T WANT TO BE A MOD. HERE'S WHY.

BEING A MOD REQUIRES A LEVEL OF RESPONSIBILITY TO YOURSELF, YOUR TEAM, AND YOUR COMMUNITY. AS A MOD YOU HAVE A DUTY TO UPHOLD THE RULES AND THE VALUES THOSE RULES ARE MEANT TO PROTECT. IN DOING SO, YOU MUST PUT FORTH SIGNIFICANT EFFORT TO BE AS THOROUGH, IMPARTIAL, AND REASONABLE AS POSSIBLE. THIS REQUIRES A SIGNIFICANT INVESTMENT OF TIME AND A HIGH LEVEL OF DEDICATION.

AS A PERSON WHO UNDERSTANDS WHAT BEING A GOOD MOD ENTAILS BY HAVING EXPERIENCE WITH IT IN THE PAST, I CANNOT IN GOOD CONSCIENCE PRETEND THAT I WOULD BE ABLE TO LIVE UP TO THE TIME COMMITMENT DEMANDED BY THE STANDARDS THAT MYSELF AND THE COMMUNITY SHOULD HOLD A MOD TO.

WHAT'S SAD IS THAT IT'S OBVIOUS FROM THE RESPONSES TO THIS POST THAT WE HAVE MODERATORS WHO DON'T CARE HALF AS MUCH AS A GUY WHO PRETENDS TO BE A WALRUS ON THE INTERNET.
WildWalrus
about 8 years

Giga13 says


WildWalrus says


Giga13 says


D3xTr0m3th0rph4n says

It would be nice if the mod team was more professional, and would stop circle jerking. The things that pisses me off about the mods is the ammount of trolling they do on the fourms.


This is one of my biggest pet peeves as a moderator or a non-moderator and while joking once in a while is alright, we're trying to make sure that each issue gets addressed seriously at some point first and foremost.



IF YOU WANT TO STOP LOOKING LIKE A JOKE, THEN STOP TREATING SERIOUS COMMUNITY ISSUES LIKE A JOKE.


I have never treated a serious community issue like a joke, thanks for the false accusation though




IN YOUR PREVIOUS POSTS YOU DO TWO THINGS:

1. ASK WHY WALRUS IS POSTING THIS, AS HIS "VIO HAS BEEN OVERTURNED ALREADY"

2. STATE THAT, WHILE JOKING AROUND IS ACCEPTABLE, ALL MODS ARE TRYING TO WORK THROUGH ISSUES AND TAKE THEM SERIOUSLY

WALRUS HAS CLEARLY HIGHLIGHTED A RELEVANT ISSUE, BUT THERE'S INACTION AND NO COMMUNICATION FROM THE MOD TEAM EXCEPT FOR THOSE BLATANTLY STATING THAT THEY HAVEN'T BOTHERED READING THOSE ISSUES. SO WHICH IS IT?

ARE THE MODS WORKING TO ADDRESS THIS ISSUE? OR ARE THEY PATTING THEMSELVES ON THE BACK BECAUSE THEY SIMPLY DID THE BARE MINIMUM?

THE ANSWER TO #1 IS IN THE OP BTW.

WHAT CHOICE DO WE HAVE BUT TO INTERPRET THAT YOU DON'T TAKE THIS SERIOUSLY IF YOU CAN'T BOTHER TO PRETEND TO READ THE OP?
Giga13
about 8 years

WildWalrus says


Giga13 says


D3xTr0m3th0rph4n says

It would be nice if the mod team was more professional, and would stop circle jerking. The things that pisses me off about the mods is the ammount of trolling they do on the fourms.


This is one of my biggest pet peeves as a moderator or a non-moderator and while joking once in a while is alright, we're trying to make sure that each issue gets addressed seriously at some point first and foremost.



IF YOU WANT TO STOP LOOKING LIKE A JOKE, THEN STOP TREATING SERIOUS COMMUNITY ISSUES LIKE A JOKE.


I have never treated a serious community issue like a joke, thanks for the false accusation though
WildWalrus
about 8 years

Sims says

i'm a forum mod, the only thing here that concerns me are your posts



WHICH, IRONICALLY, YOU DID NOT READ.
Sims
about 8 years
i'm a forum mod, the only thing here that concerns me are your posts
WildWalrus
about 8 years

Sims says


WildWalrus says


Sims says

moderators don't owe anything to people who are consistently toxic and unpleasant. they're volunteer moderators on an Internet website, not employees in a business, workers for the government, or any other analogy that would require them to "act professionally" to rude people




KEEP CLINGING TO POWER AND AVOID ANSWERING THE ISSUES AT HAND.

KEEP TRYING TO PUT DOWN ANYONE WHO DARE STAND UP AGAINST YOU.


if I wanted to cling to power or put down people who stand against me, i would have forum suspended you a long time ago because you are absolutely insufferable

@golbolco I barely know what people are complaining about but even if someone is lobby camping a mod, the mod should call someone else to do the kicking/suspending just to keep it unbiased. overall I think it's a minor issue that seems to have been fixed/overturned, but whether pam and anna were wrong or not doesn't excuse rudeness




NO, IF YOU ACTUALLY CARED ABOUT BEING COMPETENT THEN YOU'D ACTUALLY PUT SOME EFFORT INTO READING ANYTHING. SLOWBRO 2.0
Sims
about 8 years
not specific to this thread
Hibiki
about 8 years
i mean if you lowercase the thread hes not really being rude at all
Sims
about 8 years

WildWalrus says


Sims says

moderators don't owe anything to people who are consistently toxic and unpleasant. they're volunteer moderators on an Internet website, not employees in a business, workers for the government, or any other analogy that would require them to "act professionally" to rude people




KEEP CLINGING TO POWER AND AVOID ANSWERING THE ISSUES AT HAND.

KEEP TRYING TO PUT DOWN ANYONE WHO DARE STAND UP AGAINST YOU.


if I wanted to cling to power or put down people who stand against me, i would have forum suspended you a long time ago because you are absolutely insufferable

@golbolco I barely know what people are complaining about but even if someone is lobby camping a mod, the mod should call someone else to do the kicking/suspending just to keep it unbiased. overall I think it's a minor issue that seems to have been fixed/overturned, but whether pam and anna were wrong or not doesn't excuse rudeness
deletedabout 8 years

WildWalrus says


Sims says

moderators don't owe anything to people who are consistently toxic and unpleasant. they're volunteer moderators on an Internet website, not employees in a business, workers for the government, or any other analogy that would require them to "act professionally" to rude people




KEEP CLINGING TO POWER AND AVOID ANSWERING THE ISSUES AT HAND.

KEEP TRYING TO PUT DOWN ANYONE WHO DARE STAND UP AGAINST YOU.