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ban guns from competitive games

deletedover 10 years

people are using the same mentality for shooting a gun as lynching, it's absolutely impossible to make a competitively viable setup with guns, they promote trolling and gamethrowing, the power to instantly remove one person from the game is overbearing and this community can't handle it. furthermore, remove deputy, sniper and gunsmith from competitive lobby and training lobby. part of the problem is guns cause games to become trollish, fast-paced and lower effort which has leaked onto other games, guns probably should be banned from competitive lobby yes, guns are slowly killing competitive lobby. and by slowly, i mean someone get nikki on the phone and tell him to ban guns from competitive lobby. guns are becoming the new lynch, that'st he problem with most new setups. lynching is only ever for lylos now, and equivalent to set in stone absolutes, rather than placeholders for FOSes and reactions. it also encourages a chain of command that makes reading harder, hence why most gun setups end up being scumsided. not only do you run the risk of a *** pr, you also lose any valuable voting process and instead get SHOOT KYLE LOL a bunch. by replacing lynching for a ML with guns, you effectively neuter most competent setups and ruin any form of methodical strategy that could be employed.

guns shouldnt be in comp lobby.. plain and simple, they are either game breaking for town and make easy wins out of nothing or they give mafia a free win because the person with gun shoots. also , theres an entire rule dedicated to hipfiring with guns. guns give people an excuse to grudge lynch people without being able to be opposed. if youre pr with gun you have full control no matter how much town objects, which is just silly.

setup the best setup is what more setups should look like. both PRs shoudl optimally hide instead of claiming , PR claim d1 is the only bad thing about VDLI. if one of the power roles was squishy instead of hard to kill (doc is "squishy, bp is "hard to kill", etc") then it would be great , imo.

and i remember when people actually LIKED playing those scumhunt based setups,. they preferred it to gimmick ones. regardless of whether anyone thinks overall play is worse or better, the attitude people have towards scumhunt setups or scumhunting in general is worse now, which makes overall play worse as a result.

YeezusWest
over 10 years

kyle says

again junter, i tried to run on vdli this round but i couldn't wait 20+ minutes for every game to fill. competitions as a whole are too dead for that mentality in both comp lobby and training lobby. you have to play the most popular setup unless you have tons of free time


vdli has been played more than the other one this round. also, in vdli, the strategy is just "self vote give clear hammer", which is essentially a gun
deletedover 10 years
this is ridiculous. pranay, learn to debate without insulting people.
Sammie
over 10 years
also what exact skills involved in guns that you cant just do with a regular lynch? im really curious since guns are the same thing as lynches in most setups that they get used in.
pranay7744
over 10 years
bear you are a noob. you know nothing about guns. for example you can gun your townread before lylo. your mind is too narrow to see everything. i am not even gonna bother reasoning with people like you.
YeezusWest
over 10 years

Sammie says


YeezusWest says

how about...u just dont play setups with guns


maybe because gun setups utterly dominate play every time they are comped? maybe because me and many others would like to actually enjoy a setup that doesnt have a gun every 2 rounds?


damn ure really condescending
Sammie
over 10 years

pranay7744 says

the randomized thing i talked about is in response to someone's comment. it is nowhere near to what you are talking about.

also you have no idea about skill. there is so much you can do with gun in play. also by everyone you just mean the noobs who voted in this thread. 12 players who have no idea about anything.


ah yes so anyone who disagrees with you has no idea about anything. good call. just because you play way too much doesnt make you an expert.

youre not even old enough to be on my user ID list that is about a little more than 2 years old. you werent around when the meta was different. id like to go back to that meta instead of play in this current one and getting rid of guns is a step towards that. there went any guns in the old meta. we had to rely on other things instead of gimmick roles.
deletedover 10 years
again junter, i tried to run on vdli this round but i couldn't wait 20+ minutes for every game to fill. competitions as a whole are too dead for that mentality in both comp lobby and training lobby. you have to play the most popular setup unless you have tons of free time
Warrens
over 10 years
i've been on this site so long that its actually sickening
deletedover 10 years
theres tons you can do with an anarchist bomb as well. should we go ahead and unban anarchist?
deletedover 10 years

pranay7744 says

the randomized thing i talked about is in response to someone's comment. it is nowhere near to what you are talking about.

also you have no idea about skill. there is so much you can do with gun in play. also by everyone you just mean the noobs who voted in this thread. 12 players who have no idea about anything.


guys, you can do SO much with guns. you can shoot, you can choose not to shoot, there's a lot of diversity it adds to setups.
Warrens
over 10 years

YeezusWest says

how about...u just dont play setups with guns


comp lobby is dead so its almost impossible to play setups you like.
Sammie
over 10 years

YeezusWest says

how about...u just dont play setups with guns


maybe because gun setups utterly dominate play every time they are comped? maybe because me and many others would like to actually enjoy a setup that doesnt have a gun every 2 rounds?
YeezusWest
over 10 years
how about...u just dont play setups with guns
deletedover 10 years

pranay7744 says

guns have been used for a very long time without any problems. by banning it you will only limit the scope for strategy evolution


you're missing the point. there have been problems, mislynches are being more rushed and people have gotten tons lazier because they're used to the "shoot him" mentality that guns bring. guns have devolved strategies i think, but if not feel free to mention the strategies that have evolved for guns, or not because i'm bad at mafia and every point i've made is invalidated because of that.
pranay7744
over 10 years
the randomized thing i talked about is in response to someone's comment. it is nowhere near to what you are talking about.

also you have no idea about skill. there is so much you can do with gun in play. also by everyone you just mean the noobs who voted in this thread. 12 players who have no idea about anything.
Sammie
over 10 years
i find it pretty hilarious the person in this thread that's been active the least amount of time (sans bronto) is the only one arguing in favor of guns.
deletedover 10 years

pranay7744 says

guns have been used for a very long time without any problems. by banning it you will only limit the scope for strategy evolution


there have actually been numerous problems with gun setups.
pranay7744
over 10 years
guns have been used for a very long time without any problems. by banning it you will only limit the scope for strategy evolution
Sammie
over 10 years

pranay7744 says

1- it isnt randomized

2- a little bit of power tilt is not bad

3- everybody gets their chance

4- it tests skills on different levels


1 - yes it is. so what sort of devices do you use in game to swing the RNG in your favor to flip sheriff or deputy? oh wait, it is random.

2 - "a little bit" should mean a little bit, not 1 player having entire dictatorship over the entire game and absolutely no one gets a say that matters. if town disagrees with PR on a normal mislynch they can change the lynch with a majority, not so with a gun.. the person with gun shoots and then its lylo and you HAVE to follow PR. so really winning is 100% dependent on who has the gun. awful mechanic.

3 - how does "Everybody get their chance"? are you saying because its possible for everyone to flip sheriff/dep/bp that makes it fair? most gun setups have full control given to the gun holder and no one else gets a say as explained in 2.

4 - "tests" skills? what skills? being able to blindly shoot a guy is a test of skill? how is that more skillful than trying to lead the town normally? i would argue having to lynch is MORE skillful than just shooting a gun , and makes for better mafia play, too.

also let's just ignore the fact whenever anyone doesnt agree with your twisted views that you call them an idiot.
deletedover 10 years
is it possible to ban someone from viewing a thread? if so, pranay deserves to be threadbanned.
Giga
over 10 years
I'll actually just delete their posts
deletedover 10 years
if this turns into an insult-fest i'll just lock this thread honestly
deletedover 10 years


bear has no idea how to play gun setups. everything he said is wrong.


i won my first gold by 400 points on A&D
deletedover 10 years

pranay7744 says

retti you dont understand. you want to play just one kind of mafia game. you are bad at mafia if you cant involve gun as a team strength. it is not always about the lynch. that is just one aspect of mafia. a sheriff in town has the power. he can be tamed too. bear has no idea how to play gun setups. everything he said is wrong.


I want to play a game where chances are fair and games aren't decided at the whim of another.
deletedover 10 years
i'd like to know how guns test skills on different levels, if you mean being bp in a&d then yeah, being bp in a&d is challenging but that's more because you're a lone pr given an absolute leadership position over the game, and to be frank it might be even tougher if they weren't able to skip the lynch process for their first choice player to remove from the game which contradicts your point that it test skills