Back to Epicmafia

How to make maf lose when cop n1'd

packidy
over 9 years

In fancy pants if cop dies n1, you can just nl until meteor.

Have players 1, 2, & 3 vote player 4. Then have player 5 & 6 vote player 3. Wait for timer to run out. Have 1 person kick.

Player 4 then has 2 options. He can vote player 3 and force meteor or he can self vote and die. Because he is the one being lynched if he is town he can legally force meteor. Meteor is only GT if you are not faced with an autolose situation. If player 4 is village then, its not gt since he has no possible way to win.

However if player 4 is maf, he then must self vote since he isnt in an autolose scenario.

Either way, mafia will lose. You may argue "but if meteor is drawn town loses too" and you are correct. But mafia wont be down with this strategy. You'll figure out who they are before the votes ever get locked.

I give you all this strategy because I came up with it 3 weeks ago and have been reported 3 times in roughly 5 games when this has happened. The first time I was not given a violation for this strategy. The mod said they were discussing it with the admin and although it is unfair to maf it is within the rules. I was reported yesterday and given a vio today from another report. This is inconsistency within the moderating team and if I was given the OK to do this approach by one mod I'd like to think others wouldnt give me vios for something I was told was ok.

What do you guys think? Is this OGI? Is using the rules to your advantage really OGI? Are not rules a part of the game itself?

grifiest
over 6 years
id kill n2 if i killed cop n1. nking until meteor is a coward move
ivana
over 6 years
Lmaoooo you negged this on 3 accounts.
deletedover 6 years
indeed
ivana
over 6 years
matt you are a meme
deletedover 6 years

Transcend says

tl;dr fancy pants all-star packidy goes complete ape**** while contradicting himself multiple times.


ahahahahahaha lol
deletedover 6 years
holy sh*t i reflexively negged this thread three times across 33 months lol
deletedover 6 years
AMAZING
TheeCake
over 9 years
Actually, now that I think if it even more, if town knows that the only way they can advocate for the strat is if orc is the PR, and the PR says they are orc and to do the strat, the town can reasonably assume the PR is orc, because if the PR isn't orc they could be reported for throwing.

So, I guess its a legal strategy, as long as the PR is orc and advocates the strat.
TheeCake
over 9 years

packidy says

This can be argued one of two ways.
1) If you are blue with the hammer and the pr is orc you are in autolose whether you realize it or not. That doesnt change the matter.


Doesn't matter. It has to be reasonably known that the situation is autoloss, not just that it is autoloss. It is impossible for the blue to know which PR the PR is, no matter what the PR claims.


packidy says

2) "Perception of autoloss is a necessity as the rule is defined by intent." says Hibiki. "It's not gamethrowing if you recognize that your choice is between autoloss and autloss" If this is true of the rule (personal perception isnt specifically mentioned) then anyone unaware of the reality that only an ORC would be autoloss could force meteor because their misunderstanding of the rules gives them the perception of autoloss.


The problem is, its not just the blue thats getting lynched that could be reported, its every town in the room that goes along with the plan. Doing this strat, in the current game, lowers town's odds of winning. If just one person recognizes this, they can put a halt to your strategy and you can't even call them mafia for it.
packidy
over 9 years

TheeCake says


packidy says

We realized that long ago and changed it to only when orc is pr is this feasible. Because when orc is pr there is nothing the orc can do to save the game after a villager is lynched so that would be a true autoloss. Therefore its ok for a villager to force meteor.


Except the blue has no way to reasonably know the orc is orc, and should still selfhammer.


This can be argued one of two ways.
1) If you are blue with the hammer and the pr is orc you are in autolose whether you realize it or not. That doesnt change the matter.

2) "Perception of autoloss is a necessity as the rule is defined by intent." says Hibiki. "It's not gamethrowing if you recognize that your choice is between autoloss and autloss" If this is true of the rule (personal perception isnt specifically mentioned) then anyone unaware of the reality that only an ORC would be autoloss could force meteor because their misunderstanding of the rules gives them the perception of autoloss.
TheeCake
over 9 years

packidy says

We realized that long ago and changed it to only when orc is pr is this feasible. Because when orc is pr there is nothing the orc can do to save the game after a villager is lynched so that would be a true autoloss. Therefore its ok for a villager to force meteor.


Except the blue has no way to reasonably know the orc is orc, and should still selfhammer.
HighSpace
over 9 years
Oh, so its designed as a reaction test. And town wouldn't be opposed to that, because assuming mafia would self-hammer over forcing metetor, its the same as having the clear pick the lynch (which is the accepted meta in fancy pants I think?)

There's also the fact that these players generally don't mind leaving the game up to bingo. Will mafia force meteor out of spite? Are we actually voting town? We'll find out via bingo!

Therefore, mafia should learn to play along instead of opposing the idea, and this would become useless.
deletedover 9 years
"This person dare speak against me? Yeah get lynched kiddo"
packidy
over 9 years

HighSpace says

There's one thing I don't get.

Sure, this loophole strategy is dandy when mafia is forced to self-lynch. But what happens if a town is faced with that situation? Town just... loses?


Yeah, town would lose. Everyone would lose. Town and mafia. Because all the mafia is 1 mislynch away from a win though, it is likely they will argue against this strategy for some poorly explained reason or another. At this point, you can switch the votes so that the player who is against this is now in the hammer position.
packidy
over 9 years

Jaleb says


packidy says

We realized that long ago and changed it to only when orc is pr is this feasible. Because when orc is pr there is nothing the orc can do to save the game after a villager is lynched so that would be a true autoloss. Therefore its ok for a villager to force meteor.


Or you know, have the orc actually read and hammer treating as if it was lylo.


Reading is a part of the game, to assume this strategy doesnt require a scumhunt is foolish. The problem with the pr hammering though is that if the pr is wrong mafia wins. With this strategy mafia is well aware that meteor will cause them to lose so they will scumtell. Thats why you dont leave it up to pr. The pr still scumhunts though and puts his #1 fos in the position to be lynched.
HighSpace
over 9 years
There's one thing I don't get.

Sure, this loophole strategy is dandy when mafia is forced to self-lynch. But what happens if a town is faced with that situation? Town just... loses?
Jaleb
over 9 years

packidy says

We realized that long ago and changed it to only when orc is pr is this feasible. Because when orc is pr there is nothing the orc can do to save the game after a villager is lynched so that would be a true autoloss. Therefore its ok for a villager to force meteor.


Or you know, have the orc actually read and hammer treating as if it was lylo.
packidy
over 9 years
We realized that long ago and changed it to only when orc is pr is this feasible. Because when orc is pr there is nothing the orc can do to save the game after a villager is lynched so that would be a true autoloss. Therefore its ok for a villager to force meteor.
TheeCake
over 9 years
As hibiki said, blues should selfvote in this scenario because bomb/doc could be alive, making the tactic useless.
deletedover 9 years
how to make maf lose in mafia: lynch mafia
packidy
over 9 years

Sanctify says


packidy says


hedger says

"open for a debate"

>ignores the 50 points made against it and still acts like it's a good idea


I have ignored personal insults but replied to just about every negative comment on the strat with a counterpoint. If theres an issue you feel I'm ignoring go ahead and reiterate it so I can debate the issue.


you're trying to turn the games into guarenteed mafia loses, aka a bad game because once you flip mafia you know you're either going to get lynched d1 or town is going to force meteor on you if you don't play to give them an advantage.

You don't realize it, but you're pretty freaking stupid lol


IDK the history of this site but I'm sure when cop died n1 maf didnt always nk until meteor. Someone figure it out as a loophole to give their team better odds. This is no different. Its just new but eventually it may become standard strategy just as nk'ing has. You say this is bad for mafia..ok so? It's a townsided strategy. But the mafia can counter by killing to prevent meteor.

You're right though, I don't realize that im pretty freaking stupid. So please, explain to me using examples to defend your accusation against me of being stupid. I mean, if you're smart enough to realize it, you must be smart enough to explain your allegation as well using clear cut examples to support your claim.
Sanctify
over 9 years

packidy says


hedger says

"open for a debate"

>ignores the 50 points made against it and still acts like it's a good idea


I have ignored personal insults but replied to just about every negative comment on the strat with a counterpoint. If theres an issue you feel I'm ignoring go ahead and reiterate it so I can debate the issue.


you're trying to turn the games into guarenteed mafia loses, aka a bad game because once you flip mafia you know you're either going to get lynched d1 or town is going to force meteor on you if you don't play to give them an advantage.

You don't realize it, but you're pretty freaking stupid lol
packidy
over 9 years

hedger says

"open for a debate"

>ignores the 50 points made against it and still acts like it's a good idea


I have ignored personal insults but replied to just about every negative comment on the strat with a counterpoint. If theres an issue you feel I'm ignoring go ahead and reiterate it so I can debate the issue.
hedger
over 9 years
"open for a debate"

>ignores the 50 points made against it and still acts like it's a good idea
Sanctify
over 9 years
this is a very stupid strategy and i hope you get site banned so you cannot further ruin an already horrible setup