I would like to have a thought provoking and civil conversation about ISIS.....what you think will stop them, what will make it worse. Please make this a civil and appropriate discussion. i am looking for a good conversation not a flame war.
I think the question you should ask yourselves is whether or not ISIS would exist if it wasn't following the tenets of Islam but, say, an another religion. Would ISIS exist if its leaders were practicing Christianity? Would they still be committing heinous acts if they were "People of the Book"? Or, would they still be performing atrocities sans religion?
That is where we differ. I have my reasons for believing they would use any religion at their disposal to garner enough support to do what they are doing now, because the actions themselves are what they desire, not the 'glory for Allah.'
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Not in the slightest. On the contrary, I enjoy it quite a lot. I don't like to think that every person should have the same mindset or believe in the same set of regulations. I believe everything's up to interpretation. Fun fact, in Islamic Shari'a, there are 4 "Imams" who have had their own respectable takes on some Islamic rules and whatnot of which Muslims usually take their pick regarding who to follow depending on the circumstance. None of them are wrong and all of them are equally respected, it kind of makes things a lot more fluid and lenient among a culture full of different people.
Jackhammer, doesn't the breadth of possible Islamic beliefs bother you?
deletedalmost 10 years
that there are no parts, actually. thus far we have established that it doesn't matter if it's islam or not. where do we go next?
deletedalmost 10 years
Also very, very true.
deletedalmost 10 years
Exactly. If your approach to Islam is that it condones violence then so be it. I believe that isn't the correct approach and x or y might believe it is the correct one. Islam and Muslims are too diverse to be bunched up together that way, honestly.
I think if you aren't an Arabic speaker and only read translations of the Qura'an, it's hard to see how extremely flexible the text is and how many different interpretations you can get out of it (especially when you stop regarding it as a literal work).
deletedalmost 10 years
i wanna hear an opinion that isn't to a ridiculous end
It's how I understood it when Grannie started saying how "Islam condones violence", which for me implies there's only one Islam (-> ISIS' version or whatever).
deletedalmost 10 years
I find myself concurring with you and Peta, heh. Islam's not just 1 view, it's too diverse to be regarded as 1 thing.
deletedalmost 10 years
Grannie stating that "there's only 1 correct" view of Islam or whatnot
We're in agreement here. I think Peta has the same opinion as well. Jack implies a different one with his last post, but I'm not sure. NVM.
deletedalmost 10 years
whether it's 'real islam' or not is a non-issue unless ur considering rounding up all moderate muslims into confinement or thinking of eradicating islam outright. ur all having a really fcking ridiculous debate.
I'm a little confused which part you find ridiculous. Both Grannie;s and statement and mine or just Grannie's?
deletedalmost 10 years
Okay sure, I do enjoy my Greek philosophy as well. We should actually do this and not lazy out like every other time.
deletedalmost 10 years
That's ridiculous. Muslims 'round here seem to be regarding Islam as a set of rules that just make their lives harder by stopping them from doing x or y or z. (A lot of the things they might believe to be "Haram" are very debatable and, in some cases, kind of dumb actually.) I find myself hovering over the side that the rules of Islam or whatnot are there to make lives easier, as I feel like a lot of what it is is just built around life, not the other way around. The "punishments" that may be regarded extreme have hardly been ever used in Islam at all anyhow. I don't see why ISIS and such are allowed to justify their brutalization with Islam when Mohammed himself and a lot of his older followers only ever punished sinners when they themselves offered to be punished (those were the recorded instances, anyhow).
Yeah their arguments, although often well-intended, are pretty hollow. You can't just write it off as "not being the real Islam". You can say there are (in most regions a vast majority of) people who are Muslim and do not believe in ISIS' ideals, sure, which should be enough really. One just has to recognize that these are simply different beliefs.
And that thread of yours got me listening to Sleeper Agent and they're freaking awesome.
