I will compare it because it's still childish behavior that is detrimental to the site and moderators which has been done more recently than anything I've done the last 9 months. Ive been a good egg while all you've done is harassed the moderators for having unclean history with the site. Not necessarily one to be a role model yet wants certain rules he hasn't broken to prevent mods from being mods
Edit: Also lets not make this into an anti poser debate, the question is whether cheaters should be modded (sadly.. we've enough cheaters to label this as a group)
-------------------------------------------------- I believe mods should have integrity. Do you agree poser?
I think you're severely mistaken and blinded by being second best to me during one of these runs. I wouldn't say a user who accuses moderators of deleting threads in order to create a conspiracy is mod material but that isn't in the rules is it? So you're probably fine with that one. I'm sorry that I cheated but 90% of my trophy is legitimate.
It is fair that I served a shorter ban length. I didn't evade, I gave to the site previously. I had a leash I didn't break. I got many many cheaters banned before I actually cheated myself plus I helped find tons of banned users so I deserved favoritism :D
Your cheating was perhaps almost a year ago, but the date you should be unbanned from is not the date you last cheated. Your time starts from the date you get caught.
You don't get to count all the time everyone thought you were legit.
And I 100% agree with you, people who OPI should not be made mods.
Perhaps people who cheated years in the past have reformed and can be made a mod. Not someone who cheated four rounds under a year ago.
Actually, you're right. Only two are from a year ago and the other are 11/10 months. At this rate I would be unbanned fully as it is so I don't see why you're upset here. Cheaters can reform. Many of the good users who don't get modded are probably just not a good choice. Whether that's due to bias or immaturity, there would be absolute chaos if we modded anyone who seemed nice only rather than qualified. Plus, if we don't mod cheaters I can see us losing a lot of mods and an admin here. Then what? Do we not mod users who have set a bad example to begin with outside of cheating? Like HC harassment OPI? Because if we disallow cheater mods, how can we possibly forgive someone who puts personal information of users into the site or relentlessly harms someone? In the end you'll be hard-pressed to find any user who has a perfect track record. I would think that if we want to get rid of mods who roleshare that any violation harsher than that is also gonna get you pushed back to the line as well. It's up to discretion. Nobody will mod a cheater who they believe hasn't reformed. It's still with plenty of stigma.
Whether cheaters should be mods or not, I believe in fairness.
Do you think its fair to the users who didn't cheat during your reign of terror? Do you think its fair that you get to keep your account with your trophies and be on the hall of fame, whilst others missed out? Do you think its fair that you served a ban length much shorter than other users who cheated much less than you? Do you think its fair that after you were unbanned you are allowed to play in comp straight away, when other users were banned for an additional 6 months after their lobby unban? Do you think its fair that within months of your unbanning you become a mod, when others who did no cheating have been continually declined.
Imagine being someone who always was in your shadow, never could achieve a gold trophy. This person worked hard played fair and lost out a gold due to your cheating. This person applied to be a mod on the site multiple times with genuine interest and will to help. This person then sees you get a mod position, the very same person who took that coveted gold trophy from them. Is this fair?
You not only took away all recognition and sense of self worth from this person, you also were rewarded with a position that this person has sought out for a long time. You took so much from this person and then were rewarded for it even after it came out.
Imagine how they feel, but I guess you dont care, do you?
John I don't really think you realize that this is a volunteer type of thing and not everyone has to be perfect especially considering this site is epicmafia where everyone is crazy. Where have I shown that I changed 0% since I've been unbanned? I always say I'm sorry. By the way please don't make this a debate about my sex life I would appreciate it. You probably get none but it's not my problem
Dude it's been an entire year since I've cheated plus at this rate the amount of people on this site who are competent and willing are much smaller than the days before. Back when cheaters didn't get modded it was because plenty were good enough that were legit. I've been giving to the site since I was 16 therefore my hiccup of unfortunate actions was forgiven upon no evasion and eagerness to help after getting unbanned. Sammie is also another example of mods reforming considering she's honestly the best at catching cheaters and that's likely because she's witnessed it go on from both ways multiple times.
Because all you need a mod for is to do some amount of work and not make trouble in the current mod group, and someone you don't trust but isn't a cheater would maybe do that.
Yeah I agree, cheaters can reform after dealing with the punishment and perhaps later down the line can make a good mod.
You say that "if you're caught you will be punished". Why was poser caught for cheating for 4 trophies yet served an under 2 month ban and now is a mod and can play gold hearts.
Usually the ban for cheating involves several months and then a further 6 month ban from playing gold hearts. Modding her that quick after having a lessened punishment isn't right and reflects poorly on moderators.
oh my god that must be the worst logic i've ever seen in my life. there is still a cheating violation, that means it's not ok to cheat, because if you're caught you will be punished. what is ok is people who reform, show that they can be a positive member of the site, and also have the capabilities to be a good mod. cheaters in some cases make really good mods because they know the game so intricately, since they actively tried to hide cheating. this is particularly true in cheating investigations, which takes up a serious bulk of effort come the end of rounds. you want someone who knows what they're looking for, and ex-cheaters can recognize that better than most.
also thecolonel is right, to a fault. who the mods are as people doesn't affect the game whatsoever, but it does have an effect on the community's reaction to mod decisions. if the mod has a shady past, their decisions are not going to be perceived as well. ethereal would be exhibit a for that.
I think you are downplaying the fact that Poser cheated for four trophies over a period of many months. Modding someone like this is basically telling the rest of the user base that cheating is okay. Poser was given a ridiculously short ban and punishment for her cheating and then was made a mod shortly after.
The message this sends is simply that we do not take cheating seriously as an offence.
You say Poser is a fine mod choice, I have yet to see anything from her that says she is a good moderator and better than the other options out there who haven't cheated. Poser is notoriously poor at making decisions, poor at staying impartial and unbiased and has no overwhelmingly positive qualities that suggests we need her as a mod.
Your comments about child r.apists being mods just shows the stupidity of your arguments. If you honestly believe child r.apists should be allowed to moderate you are a simply a moron. Of course trust and respect matter, you cant be taken seriously as an authority without it.
thecolonel i'm not sure if you are just trying to play devils advocate here but your two posts are polar opposite in their contention. Your first post states: "People in positions of authority need to command some amount of respect from the people they're in charge of." Then in your second post you say "Why do you think the user base should haev to trust or respect the moderators?"
You blatantly contradicted yourself and your own arguments, then made yourself look like an idiot by promoting child r.apists as fine mod choices.
Poser is a fine mod choice. Saying she pathologically lied about cheating until she was caught is like saying that OJ pathologically lied about murder. Admitting that you cheat while you cheat would make you an idiot. You don't want idiot mods.
The only actionable criticism I've seen made about poser is that she's too aggressive to potential cheaters. The only way you can tie that to her being a cheater would be that she's trying to compensate for it. That isn't a bad thing. If it doesn't have anything to do with her being a cheater then there's no reason for her cheating to put her in a bad light. It doesn't have any impact on how she moderates the game.
Why do you think the user base should have to trust or respect the moderators? If they aren't doing anything wrong it doesn't matter who they are as people. They could be child r.apists or regular r.apists or anything else and it would have no negative impact on the game you play. It's just something for you to complain about.
I'd agree with all your points, I think you misunderstand my position on this. I have been vocally against cheaters as mods in the past and still stand by that. I simply am saying that this issue isn't a simple black and white, yes or no question.
I'd agree with you and Juicy's points about trust and respect. I think it is of the utmost importance that the user base trust and respect the moderators. For this reason I do believe users who have blatantly cheated on numerous occasions and in recent times, should NOT be mods.
Poser is an example of an unbelievable misguided decision by the mod team. Poser is actually a really nice person and perhaps a semi-capable mod, however her track record is not that of someone who should be in a position of power/meaning.
Poser cheated for 4 gold trophy's very recently, then she pathologically lied about it for many months leading users to believe she was legit. I don't see how trust or respect can be given to her modding decisions after this.
2nd Round - Debate
