also I'm not versed in animal ethics I just have a mathematics-slash-veterinary-medicine mom and a lot of pampered and charismatic cats at my house, some of which have got to be more intelligent than me if not the rest of humanity........

On the other side of the coin, I'd assume there must be some aspects to intelligence that are set in stone to the extent that there's a natural-born advantage for some that creates an insurmountable gap. Nonetheless, it's a far more complex topic and that's more about range than exact level.

Again, I really do sincerely wish I hadn't made that stupid comment to you lol... Although I really appreciate and am learning from what you're saying now.

That's very fair and I believe I understand what you are saying, but I think that will take more time than that for me to learn given that I have always placed my self-worth in my intelligence. Of course, intelligence is not completely set-in-stone or clear-cut; there are many facets to it and all of those are built up by various types of experience. However, I think people generally become attached to the notion that they are valuable for a particular quality or set of qualities and hone the related skills because of it. I'm probably not completely correct about that, though. Anyway, my point is that...

Wow, what was my point? Whatever. Your philosophy on the topic seems obviously superior, but I think there are far more people than just me that could do to take it up.

u 2 brother ian

ur a funny guy tatami

Also I spat out my drink at football player but that highlights what I mean, the fact you don't know he's a basketball player says only that and nothing more.

To clarify, I'm not saying "Don't do reading" but a lot of this (at least what I responded to) required little. I may have just gotten the wrong vibe off your first post about Cody-my first impression was just that you were intimidated by the terminology despite the actual idea being pretty basic and not really requiring much reading. I'm sorry that I did not make this explicit.

While I appreciate your apology and humility with regards to the Iverson thing, I still think you're kind of missing the point. I don't know if I'm smarter than you or not. Who cares? Is intelligence set in stone or changing? I'm more knowledgeable than you in mafia and philosophy of mind, you appear to be more well versed in animal ethics and likely other areas as well. The point is comparating the idea of intelligence is something extremely vague and usually utilized for egos and not constructive. The point is to learn and share, not compare prowess.

ChilledOut says

Speaking of what sets humans apart from most/all animals, what do you think of the soul? Do humans have souls, and, if so, is it only them or other animals too?

ok here's the start of the debate.

soul is such a vague thing tho

just to be clear: it was a joke and so is my vote on the poll

ok sure!

No, I am legitimately speaking to you what I believe and not for lilin cool points

the last few pages*

wow is this whole thing just tatami and chilledout competing for the position of most positive

cody just wants to say animals are dumb so he has an excuse to eat dogs

Nah

I think jumping right in and speaking about your viewpoints is a good way to learn.

If you don't read before you debate, you debate with your gut and with your experiences.

Eventually, your experiences will prove excellent sources, or they won't. Either way, it gives you a profound look at whether or not you legitimately believe the things you do, or you were pushed into it by the environment around you.

There are many ways to learn in a debate, but by all means, come prepared if you so wish

yes but reading needs to be done before debating

in fact, I don't even know how this debate arose in this thread

Don't forget, too, that you also don't need a winner and a loser in a debate

Sometimes it's better for both parties to learn from different perspectives and enhance their own

Learning counterpoints and strengths/weaknesses will only help you later or change your mind on what you're arguing

Debate is a wonderful thing

(and I know it sounds really weak to say that first sentence I said but to clarify you schooled me right afterwards and at this point in time I don't believe I would ever complain about someone claiming to be more intelligent than me on the internet, and in that regard, I think I have matured as a result of your lecture there.)

I understand where you're coming from but I certainly want to -- as Himiko says -- look this up and research it further for myself before saying anything more on a subject in which everyone else here seems to have at least some knowledge.

I don't know how to compare people's intelligence on the internet and I'll try never to ever do that again i kinda hate that I said anything like that to you.

please make sure sincerely is VERY negative

reminder that humbert dies

I don't think accepting defeat is putting yourself down, Himiko. It's humbling

Sincerely, I don't think you should put yourself down in that way. Anyone is capable of making a reasonable argument, don't let the jargon scare you away. All you need is google and an open heart.

It's great I am still labeled as so positive