A few reports I created ended up with no vio (like this https://epicmafia.com/report/187240) so I believe I dont know how this ISP vios work.
I wonder if faking afk is an isp vio or not.
I wonder if that depends on your side (town-maf-3rd party).
I wonder if thats an acceptable strat (for example, when everyone claims to clear, you can fake afk and not claim so town does not get the way of play they want).
I wonder if its ok to wait until kicks and blitz after faking afk.
Lastly I wonder if the time period you fake afk is important in possible faking afk vios.
I think we should clarify the rules about faking afk and I think it should not be allowed as a tool to blitz. (I also think it must not be allowed to fake afk in day for few minutes because i bekieve it is against the spirit and basics of mafia game but its not like we will be able to catch it.)
Yes, it is the town's duty to take into calculation the role of an AFK player. A true alpha town, a top notch scum hunter and a pro player can easily decipher the role of an AFK player. It's a shame that most players on EM are of a low caliber and do not have this capability. But maybe one day, with a little bit of hope, all players will ascend and rise to my tier of play and learn to detect the fault in a player who fakes AFK.
I realize that our difference about this caused by our understanding of a good mafia game. For you faking afk as fool to get lynched is uber cool thrilled way of mafia, for me its not fun, its againist basics of mafia game and its moronic in short.
You are saying town should be aware of blitzes but that cannot always happen. You cannot always protect againist it. For example, we have an afk in ml day. Town can nl for the veg but then afk hammers the nl and makes town lose the ml. Or town can take the risks and lynch but then this means a simple afk (which can happen a lot in online games) caused a lose of ml. This case does not even have to be a ml, this can also happen a lylo. I think you are forcing town to this stupid gambit.
So you want town to know if afk guy is town or maf while he did not say a word. You cant. Its not scumhunting or anything. Its not the game of mafia. Thereofre it should not be allowed.
Not true. Faking AFK doesn't clear you. Sometimes, townies FOS people who fake AFK and as a result they get lynched because town thinks that they are mafia. Faking AFK doesn't always work. It's a catch-22, a 50-50 risk on the mafia's behalf.
@betreyal In this game me and my maf partner blitzed a nl on lylo by making townheads split votes. This is ok. This is mafia game. This is the blitz with thrill.
But why does it bother if you mafia "Fake AFK blitz". If anything, the town should be aware of the "mafia individual who is AFK" and should take into consideration that they may blitz. The town should be smart and vote accordingly to their strongest FOS in order to safe guard and not allow the AFK guy to blitz. If the town fail to vote accordingly to the clear or PRs then it is their fault that they lost and were AFK blitzed upon. If anything, you should be mentoring our townies to learn how to scumread better and work in unison to safeguard against a misfortunate event.
For that either Arcbell or Lucid(haha fat chance) should code it. Basically as i explained : Green next to the name if you are in the game. Press the AFK button, icon turns grey, screen is hidden.
No I'm not trying to block your blitz where you blitz in game. I'm trying to block faking afk blitzes. Also idk what are you talking about ancient chinese people, this game is not that old.
In a decent mafia game no one should bother about who is really there or faking afk. It is not like there is an actual way to know it.
Sol what do you think about removing GRS vios bc some innocent people are getting those too?
But blitzing is an ancient Chinese art, where every scum plays their part! You can't remove blitzing from the game, it adds thrill and excitement to being Mafia. Blitzing is a legitimate strategy in all forms of Mafia, from the ancient forum mafia to the later versions of Chat mafia and now, Epic Mafia. What you are trying to do is remove the "blitz tactic" from the game of mafia which I will not allow. Without the ability to blitz, mafia won't be the same anymore.
And even if the things you say happen, it can happen betreyal. Its ok to have a few wrong vios rather than allowing a lot of wrong actions.
In my system, (I dont think it will cause that but anyways) there can be wrong vios if you really come back at kicks but this will be rare. This will be rare like wrong GRS vios. A lot player including me had some GRS vios because our vegs looked like GRS (because we really had to go afk when its autolose etc).
But you dont offer "hey, some good people can get grs vios too, you cant know, so remove all grs vios". You just accept it as it is and know that accidental grs's will stay in 8 vio limit anyways.
Thats simply not true. When rules are defined in the way I explained, you can tell "hey may be he did not blitz to avoid a vio." And this was a thing already, few years ago blitzing with faking afk was a certain vio and we had to talk and make people unvote before doing it so we dont get vios.
Implementing such a system would could cause connection issues or some people to lag. Some people play on their smart phones, would the reconnect system still be compatible on such a small device? Adding such a feature is not as simple as it sounds.
Actually now that i reread, i would like to say that the second suggestion is much better.
You have to go afk? Just press the button and go. No one will fos you for faking afk, because tehre is no way to see the game while the afk button is pressed.
Yes, but if "Mafia A" comes back and says "Hey townie unvote, I'm not vegging" then that will convince the other townies that "Mafia A" is town-sided and not scum. Ultimately, that will change the course of the game and cause "Mafia A" to be cleared and cause town to lose the game. This will result in more Mafia wins than town wins in games that have scum who are gone before kicks. In the end, you are lowering the odds of winning the game as town which will negatively distort the balance of town vs mafia wins.
Here comes the Nice Neighbourhood Xxerox. I got PM about this, so i decided to look.
Before time there were bubbles.
It was acceptale strategy to look for bubbles day start and lynch those that had them.It was the most normal thing in the world, just like Fake Afk is now.
So, only thing i can suggest is that a new AFK system is installed.
If you do not write anything for 5 minutes, your screen turns grey and a button appears :"Recconect" - Press Recconect to connect back into your game.
And inside the game , those players will have a gray circle next to their name (Graveyard too)
That way if you are really AFK, people will see you were afk because your circle was grey and not green, and also if you were faking afk, you would not be able to really see the game , otherwise the circle will flip green, and all will see you were faking afk.
We are talking about majour AFK 5 minutes or more. That way we can stop the hardcore fake AFK.
Another suggestion would be, an AFK button. When a player presses the button, he goes afk, his screen turns grey. This sounds even better than the previous idea, and is much more easyer to implicate, but whatever rows your boat :)
Participating the game for 2 days and faking afk at 3rd day are different cases and should not affect each other. "Entire course of game" is too large. You can abuse the game by faking afk one day anyways. It should be vio even if it is one day. In the report I wrote about in topic text, the reported player faked afk in last day only because he needed it in last day. I think if someone fakes afk to blitz it must be a vio without considering what he did in other days.
Faking afk was defined/ruled in ISP vios. I can write argument about how faking afk can fit into ISP definition but definitions, words does not matter. Actions does.
Betreyal You say "Mafia A returns to the game and hammers on the townie. " For third time: If Mafia A comes at that moment he should write "hey people, im back, unvote, im not vegging" and give people time to do it. If he really comes back at that time and blitzes it is still bad intention and should be vio'd. So as you can see for a player with good intentions there will never be a vio.
If he comes back after some votes are kicked, he must veg. Thats the justice.
Yes expose but there are some players who are known to lurk and that is their normal game play. Through meta, are those players supposed to be punished for their normal lurking behavior or are they barred from this rule?
The ISP rule is moderated over the entire course of the game, and not on a per-day basis. If a player is afk one day but comes back and participates sufficiently the rest of the game then it's not ISP. We don't want to punish those who accidentally forget about the game or tab out, as we've all done that at some point. The ISP rule is there to prevent players from gaining a significant advantage by refusing to participate sufficiently throughout the entire course of the game, and to punish those who directly cause a loss due to negligence. What is deemed sufficient is up to the moderator's discretion.
if mafia want to fake afk and not say a word within the first 3-4 minutes of the game (aka pretending they don't have a night action and were a blue), it has been allowed
so the reason soda didn't get a vio in the game you brought up is because he wasn't in violation of isp because he 'tried' the following days
i don't really get why you reported him? he wasn't "afk all day" lol
