Epicmafia

What's the point of an appeal?

over 8 years

I'm just trying to understand the system itself. I'm sure we can all agree that a method for double checking reports is a good thing. Yet it's far too easy to question the actual validity of the system itself when (as will be discussed) the system is highly subjective to an unpunishable abuse of moderation power.

A recent example (leaving names out to protect privacy) would be where a user received a violation and it was upheld through an appeal. The user in question then threw a bitchfit on the forum, quite clearly for the purpose of causing drama (as seen by the way they tried to publicize the issue, as well as presenting the issue in a manner that was not even the slightest way impartial, and threatening to leave the website), where a third mod stepped in and also confirmed that they would have handed out a vio as well. Finally, a fourth unnamed mod (who is quite slow, worthless, albeit somewhat brotherly) literally claimed to: 1. not read the game, 2. not read any of the discussion, 3. read ONLY the bitchfitter's posts, step in and singlehandedly overturn the ruling upheld by three separate mods on three separate occasions.

The aforementioned incident begs the question: what is the point of the appeals system? Why have this system itself in place when:
1. Anyone literally needs a single mod on their side to get an overturned ruling, regardless of how many mods support/oppose it.
2. There is no enforcement mechanism to prevent the aforementioned abuse of mod power (among other abuses).
3. The aforementioned abuse clearly and directly undermines the validity of the appeals system itself, and also shows a lack of uniformed enforcement of the rules.
4. Let's not forget that the legitimacy of the mods is directly given from the system which they frequently undermine.
5. How/why are we supposed to take the mods, the system, and the rules seriously if its authority figures undermine the source of their authority?

Let's be clear - this isn't a question about whether or not the ruling was correct or incorrect. This is a question about whether or not this type of mod abuse practice is acceptable, as well as questioning the point of the appeals system in the first place. What's the point of having a supreme court when a single dissenting justice can singlehandedly overturn the entire system's decision with no reviewing or punishment mechanism?

Should we have maybe another system where mods can get together and review cases that are very polarizing? Absolutely. However the current situation between the community and the mods can be described as strained, at best. These types of incidents need to be dealt with both systematically and transparently, or it just makes the mods and their rules enforcement a bigger joke than it already is (if that's even possible).

W A L R U S

deletedover 8 years

WildWalrus says

If I were this mod, I would be embarrassed to be taken to town by some clown on a gimmick account, or to spend 14 posts (https://epicmafia.Com/topic/75977) denying and/or not participating in the discussion, and having another mod swoop in and do what you couldn't do in 14 posts.

You're a bigger joke than me.

I took the liberty of making the funniest part of Walrus's posts a little easier to read, so that everyone can appreciate it.

vilden

over 8 years

This guy is funny as hell

Give him what he wants

deletedover 8 years

WildWalrus says

W A L R U S WOULD LIKE TO POINT OUT THAT HIS QUESTION IN THE OP IS STILL NOT ANSWERED. W A L R U S EDITED A FEW THINGS TO MAKE IT EASIER FOR YOU TO AT LEAST PRETEND THAT YOU READ IT.

This is great. He's even still in character.

moon

over 8 years

whats the point of life

deletedover 8 years

Slowbro is getting smacked around on the forums by a guy who pretends he is a walrus.

deletedover 8 years

I plus karma'd your post for "you're a bigger joke than me"

That was a sweet diss.

WildWalrus

over 8 years

CONCLUSION XXXXX

HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO TAKE THIS SYSTEM AND ITS MODS SERIOUSLY WHEN THE SYSTEM GIVES LEGITIMACY TO CLOWNS LIKE THIS? LET'S BE CLEAR HERE. I DON'T CARE WHETHER OR NOT SOMEONE GOT A VIO OR NOT. WHAT I CARE ABOUT IS THE LEGITIMACY OF A SYSTEM THAT GIVES POWER TO A BUFFOON WITH 0 READING COMPREHENSION SKILLS, A CONSTANT OUTWARD DISPLAYING OF AN ABSENCE OF CRITICAL THINKING SKILLS, AND WHO USES SAID POWER TO UNDERMINE THE SYSTEM THAT INSTILLED HIM WITH POWER IN THE FIRST PLACE.

THIS ISN'T AN ISSUE ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT SAID MOD MADE THE RIGHT CALL OR NOT - HECK I THINK SAID MOD MADE THE RIGHT CALL IN BOTH OF MY POSTS (TO VARYING DEGREES AND FOR DIFFERENT REASONS). BUT THEY DISPLAY MENTAL ACUITY REFLECTIVE OF THEIR NAMESAKE, AS DISPLAYED BY THEIR CONSTANT IRRELEVANT BABBLE, CHILDISH THREATS, AND CONSTANT IGNORANCE WHEN ASKED TO REFER TO THE OP TIME AND TIME AGAIN. IF I WAS THIS MOD, I WOULD BE EMBARRASSED TO BE TAKEN TO TOWN BY SOME CLOWN ON A GIMMICK ACCOUNT, OR TO SPEND 14 POSTS (https://epicmafia.com/topic/75977) DENYING AND/OR NOT PARTICIPATING IN THE DISCUSSION, AND HAVING ANOTHER MOD SWOOP IN AND DO WHAT YOU COULDN'T DO IN 14 POSTS.

YOU'RE A BIGGER JOKE THAN ME.

WildWalrus

over 8 years

CONTINUED...

3. A WILLINGNESS TO DO WHATEVER YOU WANT, HOWEVER YOU WANT, AS LONG AS IT MAKES YOU FEEL GOOD.

Slowbro says

i don't care about pomp and circumstance or adhering to a system if it means making the wrong calls

THIS IS JUST ONE OF MANY EXAMPLES. LET'S SAY YOU MADE THE RIGHT CALL THOUGH. LET'S SAY EVERY TIME YOU ABUSED YOUR POWER, YOU MADE THE RIGHT CALL (WHICH IS FREQUENTLY I MIGHT ADD). THEN OBVIOUSLY THERE'S A PROBLEM WITH THE SYSTEM ITSELF - WHICH CALLS TO QUESTION (AS STATED NUMEROUS TIMES IN MY OP) WHY AND HOW THE SYSTEM IS BROKEN, AND WHY AND HOW TO FIX IT. I DON'T CARE THAT YOU OVERTURNED BENJAMIN'S VIO; I THINK HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN GIVEN A WARNING - BUT THAT'S NOT A POINT OF THIS POST. AS STATED IN THE OP:

WildWalrus says

Let's be clear - this isn't a question about whether or not the ruling was correct or incorrect.

ITS IN RED LETTERS BUT I GUESS YOU MISSED IT OVER THE SIX TIMES YOU DECIDED TO SPEW VERBAL GARBAGE INTO MY THREAD.

4. ZERO HESITATION TO MAKE CLEAR THREATS TO ABUSE YOUR POWERS IN ORDER TO COW THOSE YOU DISAGREE WITH.

Slowbro says

you're almost there... yes, i'm trying to ban you as we speak

IF YOU'RE REALLY WILLING TO BAN SOMEONE YOU DISAGREE WITH JUST BECAUSE THEY CALL YOU OUT ON YOUR OF AVOIDING ACTUALLY ANSWERING FOR ANY OF YOUR ACTIONS OR PARTICIPATING IN THE INTENDED DISCUSSION OF THE OP, THEN YOU MAKE YOURSELF LOOK LIKE A BIGGER JOKE THAN I EVER COULD.

WildWalrus

over 8 years

Slowbro says

i would probably take your complaint more seriously if it wasn't because i OT'd a vio on a guy you reported because you dislike him

WHAT ARE YOU TRYING TO IMPLY?
-YOU'D TAKE A LEGITIMATE DISCUSSION ABOUT A SYSTEMIC ABUSE OF POWER SERIOUSLY IF YOU WEREN'T THE PERPETRATOR?
-YOU'D TAKE A LEGITIMATE DISCUSSION ABOUT A SYSTEMIC ABUSE OF POWER SERIOUSLY IF SOMEONE ELSE DID IT?
-YOU'D TAKE A LEGITIMATE DISCUSSION ABOUT A SYSTEMIC ABUSE OF POWER SERIOUSLY IF I LIKE THE PEOPLE I REPORT?

IT'S REALLY HARD TO TAKE YOU SERIOUSLY, BECAUSE HERE'S WHAT YOU'VE SHOWN ME:
1. A REFUSAL TO READ ANY PARTS OF ANY DICUSSION YOU DON'T LIKE.

Slowbro says

also i've read almost nothing except what ben has said and i'd probably nv it

2. A COMPLETE LACK OF ABILITY TO EITHER READ OR APPLY READING COMPREHENSION SKILLS

WildWalrus says

...HIS QUESTION IN THE OP IS STILL NOT ANSWERED

NOTE YOU HAVEN'T EVEN TOUCHED ON ONCE THE ORIGINAL POINT OF MY OP. THE CLOSEST THING YOU'VE DONE IS PRETENDING TO READ IT BY IMPLYING "I'M NOT GOING TO TAKE YOUR OP SERIOUSLY".

MaximumPayne

over 8 years

how the fucc do you expect anyone to read this. half of us on this site are two-four days hungover or full of shi t(devante)

deletedover 8 years

i would probably take your complaint more seriously if it wasn't because i OT'd a vio on a guy you reported because you dislike him

The

over 8 years

You hit all 3 of those points in almost every game you play. I mean I'd already say that spamming caps disrupts gameplay through communications, and with your previous HC vio on record, your constant tendency to troll people should be considered more heavily.

https://epicmafia.com/game/4923005
Random spam about walruses d1, trolling postgame
"KIRI MUST MEAN DUMB IN MEXICAN"

https://epicmafia.com/game/4936550
D2 and postgame

https://epicmafia.com/game/4942224
Insults the town and/or Ben 21 times over the course of just 2 days.

https://epicmafia.com/game/4950145
Classic trolling here, as well as continuing his overused tradition of insulting the intelligence of the majority of the players repeatedly.
"JUST BECAUSE YOUR FEELINGS ARE HURT"
"DOESNT MEAN ITS SPAM KID"
"THEN WHY ARE YOU CRYING"

Shall I go on?

WildWalrus

over 8 years

rutab says

w a l r u s

S U R L A W

deletedover 8 years

w a l r u s

Golbolco

over 8 years

>mods

>reading complaints

WildWalrus

over 8 years

Satan says

as epicmafia's resident marine biologist, i can honestly say that wild walrus is not a walrus nor is he a pinniped at all.

pinnipeds cannot type

THIS IS PROBABLY THE ONLY MODPOST IN THIS ENTIRE THREAD THAT HAS ANY RATIONAL THOUGHT BEHIND IT. ALMOST AS IF NONE OF THE MODS READ THE OP AT ALL.

http://www.benchmarkeducation.com/best-practices-library/comprehension-strategies.html

WildWalrus

over 8 years

W A L R U S WOULD LIKE TO POINT OUT THAT HIS QUESTION IN THE OP IS STILL NOT ANSWERED. W A L R U S EDITED A FEW THINGS TO MAKE IT EASIER FOR YOU TO AT LEAST PRETEND THAT YOU READ IT.

Hibiki

over 8 years

loser changed his mind. any further questions?

Golbolco

over 8 years

The best thing to do is drag the mods down by their own rules. Report, complain, drama, report, complain, drama. In time the establishment will wear down, allowing new, more radical opponents to pop up. This will chase the populace to alternatives, third-party groups that want a different change entirely. By the time it's over, the entire system will have collapsed and risen from the ashes like the phoenix it is.

Satan

over 8 years

as epicmafia's resident marine biologist, i can honestly say that wild walrus is not a walrus nor is he a pinniped at all.

pinnipeds cannot type

deletedover 8 years

Wow wtf I love walrus

Devante

over 8 years

congrats on being the first person i've ever forum blocked.

this gimmick alt is annoying whoever you are

WildWalrus

over 8 years

Slowbro says

yes, i'm trying to ban you as we speak

LET ME KNOW HOW IT GOES. IF YOU'RE SUCCESSFUL MAYBE I CAN BEFRIEND A MOD TO SINGLEHANDEDLY OVERTURN IT OF THEIR OWN VOLITION WITHOUT THEM HAVING TO ANSWER TO ANYONE OR EXPLAIN WHY UNDERMINING THE SYSTEM WITHOUT A CORRECTION/FALLBACK/ABUSE PREVENTION MECHANISM IS A GOOD THING.

deletedover 8 years

yes, i'm trying to ban you as we speak

WildWalrus

over 8 years

Slowbro says

you're almost there

SRY SLOWBRO, I HAVE TOO MANY FRIENDS. I DON'T THINK I CAN FIT ANOTHER. UNLESS YOU'RE MAKING A POORLY VEILED THREAT @ PERMABANNING ME IN AN ATTEMPT TO CENSOR FORWARD & RATIONAL THOUGHT VIA ABUSE OF MOD POWERS THAT PEOPLE ARE SO FOND OF COMPLAINING ABOUT AS OF LATE.