Hey all, I had a serious discussion with moon about setups, the site meta, and how to make comp more appealing. Why not make a separate fancy pants only lobby so new players aren't introduced to a setup that, may be fun but promote theworst behaviours for learning competitve play?
Guns and Hookers is an excellent red heart setup, and more setups like those (BASIC SCUM HUNT) should be played.
To those players who only play Fancy Pants, the Fancy Pants only lobby will still fill, and everyone will still be happy.
People don't understand Fancy Pants is played for the same reason Classic or Reverse was played. People don't really wanna try hard, they just want to have some fun. In fact they prefer guessing more than scumhunting. The problem isn't Fancy Pants itself, you can blacklist this setup (it's useful to reach the 1500 points, so FP isn't useless), but the problem won't be solved. Unranked setups are pure fun, red hearts are here to learn basis and golden hearts to comp. You're too strongly focused on scores, stats and stuff. Seriously, who cares? If bad people have 150.000 points, what's the problem if they are just here to have fun with Fancy Pants?
The main problem, in my opinion, is people don't get why competitive players are so salty because comp players want people to play their best gameplay in red hearts. But red hearts and golden hearts have to be seen differently. Nevertheless I'm ok with a FP lobby because people could change their ways, like they did with Reverse lobby. If they do want to play FP, they will make the effort to change the lobby to play FP. But people have to stop complaining about FP setups and start creating games with decent ones. Because as I can see, they are more than 20 people who want to play decent games but why don't they join them when they're created?
It's not segregation, it's selfvote lobby or scumhunt lobby. I understand people don't wanna play 40 minutes games, FP is really easy to understand and we have to keep that. But it doesn't really help for golden hearts. Maybe they'll realize golden hearts need more concentration if FP games aren't played in the same lobby.
if users wanted to play setups other than fancy pants they would.
mods don't and shouldn't have the power to segregate 50% of the main lobby users based off a setup preference- especially since someone would just make a new setup similar to fp (much like what happened with you guys trying to hard to get rid of classic mafia)
Bad. This is like the competitive lobby and the training lobby. If you guys don't like Fancy Pants, you guys make your own lobby. Like what the heck? All those comp setups are all confusing as heck, so new players don't know how to play them anyways. New players play Fancy Pants because it is the best setup, and it's super easy. This is as bad as saying, "Let's make a new lobby for the noavis to play in."
My hobby was playing games and fighting over them after the fact but it's no longer a viable hobby. I'd even settle for this, but it'd take effort from people that aren't competent enough to bring it about.
Don't pander. As far as I'm concerned this horse carcass will be 6 years old in March yet I'm beating on it even though I've long since grinded the bones into dust.
ITG there's no solution that takes FP or any point farm into the future, though first building something without them as the core experience. You're free to try and fail like EVERYONE ELSE before you, but you're going to eventually use Lucid as an excuse to give up.
It's an inevitability. What happens when the point farmers get sick of FP and how is that worse than fixing the meta? I'm sure one of the first things you noticed when playing again is that this site is worse off than when you left it, and as long as we allow point farming to be the end all be all of this site it's going to remain this way. Fixing the meta so that comp isn't flooded out by point farming will only help the community grow back into what it was before all the comp players got sick of playing with point farmers. Will it be a painful process? Duh, but I'm sure a game vets enjoy playing is better than us reminiscing on the forums about bring it back.
Neither of those games pander to casuals nor are their populations waning as people get sick of their limited experiences, of which they're constantly adding to.
We have a plethora of competitive setups that will rarely see the light of day because casuals don't want to effort. Your mistake is thinking that casuals should have the baseline experience of this site when it's clear pandering to them has done nothing to the longevity of this site.
If we work to create and then maintain a space in which players can be recognized for their game related talents and efforts, you'll never have to worry about the game again. This is what our baseline experience needs to be, not afking through 10 FP games and going on with your day.
Any solution involving blacklisting/banning is unfeasible because (despite?) casuals only playing for fun, they still value the points won from the setups.
When i first joined the site, i imediately went for comp games, because the other games just sucked. Even as a new player i knew what a good play is rather than a trash play.
