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Sandbox role tier - 2018 version

moonlightseal
about 6 years

*7/3/2 standard setup btw

S tier: this is broken tier, or roles that are so good, even on their own, and can easily guarantee wins

S++: Necromancer, Resurrectionist, Zombie, Phantom

S+: Poisoner, Seer, Supervillian, Borg (cause of bugs, without bugs, its actually lower than cult)

S: Chef, Hitman, Clown, Rainmaker, turkey

S-: King, Yak, Diabolist, Snow Queen, Whistleblower, vengefulspirit

A tier: They are good roles but not really OP, can easily win games if in hand of good players

A+: Stalker, Actress, Justice, Cult, Det, Santa, Surgeon, troublemaker

A: BS, Slasher, Bride, Guiser

A-: Arsonist, Mastermind, Nomad, Usuper, Multineer, Fab, tracker, ghost/polter

B tier: They are good roles and need skills to win the game. The chance to win game when using those roles are average

B+: Queen bee, Forger, Tailor, Vent, Spy, Medusa, Scout, all cops, psychic, Monkey, Monk, Mason, demotioner

B: Watcher, mimic, dreamer, caroler, comedian, gs, armdealer, cutler, Priest, Granny, Crier, Gov, maid, amn, fool, Voodoo, Illu, asso, Hearthbreaker, Witch, ceptor, Driver, Gramp

B-: Terror, Vigs, Celeb, Tree, Tinkerer, Jailkeep, Commuter, Crat, Sidekick, Lover, tele/whisperer

C tier: They are somewhat unique roles/good in their jobs. Even when they don't help/do much, they can be a good supporter. However, they dont need too many skills to use and therefore, they may not make any big impact in the game

C+ : Don, hooker, Fillbuster, Housekeeper, loudmouth, Invi man, Agent, Jailer, Cyclist doctor, nurse, bodyguard, Avenger, Sherr, dep, Forager, Vivor, Lyncher, Mistletoe, clock, gambler

C: Jan, Ninja, Plumber, gossiper Keymaker, journalist, trapper, virgin, Penguin, Snowman, Party, Butterfly, neighbour, Killer - admirer, Anar, ww

C-: Catlady, apprentice, Inform, Look out, Lyzer, sniper, Prosecutor, robinhood, Mourner medium crank and most other dead roles

D tier: They have something that make them better than blue/nilla, or make them winnable 3rd. Yes, they are bad

ghoul, oracle, hunter, huntman, bomb, bleeder, trickster, bulletproof, snoop, gallis, soldier, gun/sharp, strongman, interrogator, toreador, fiddler, silencer, thief, librarian, butler, angel

E tier: The standards (or really hard to win 3rd): Blue, nilla, rival, prophet, thlu, alien, Partysmacker

F tier: Lightkeeper, Siren, Recruit, Jack, Vice president

Unrated tier: President, Creepy girl, Baker

moonlightseal
over 5 years
Updated with most role including deadly ones
moonlightseal
over 5 years
Updated, contain most roles in the list
SirAmelio
about 6 years

moonlightseal says

Tbh there was a game we had a really good vent. Then I forced everyone to use force leak whisper to take him down. Yeah it was an overkill solution, but I only used it once.

Vent is good, but the second people know theres a vent, vent pretty much lose most of his traits


thats what makes it mediocre though, it either has little usefulness or requires a dumb town to be really useful

when making tier list, it assumes that its pretty much robots playing at full capacity, meaning that vent would not be very useful, as it is very easy to counter (pretty much like CG: the role itself can be very good with a dumb town, but when its competent players then its super easy to counter)
SirAmelio
about 6 years

YellowPear says


SirAmelio says

strategy



SirAmelio says

sandbox





the entire idea of a tier list is doing it assuming serious gameplay. if you wanted a "fool around and be an idiot" tier list, it would be an entirely different list
moonlightseal
about 6 years
Tbh there was a game we had a really good vent. Then I forced everyone to use force leak whisper to take him down. Yeah it was an overkill solution, but I only used it once.

Vent is good, but the second people know theres a vent, vent pretty much lose most of his traits
YellowPear
about 6 years

SirAmelio says

strategy



SirAmelio says

sandbox

arials92
about 6 years
No templar? what is this?
PatricianSalafist99
about 6 years
S++++++ = forger--i get to forge great wills
SirAmelio
about 6 years

verumbark says


SirAmelio says

im more interested on why guiser is so high since its only real advantage is escaping if its cornered by a carol/dream/report and managed to survive the lynch (Not saying it's not good, but i dont think its S tier good)


im the reason guiser is s-tier


despite the love you have for the role and despite how good at it you might be, being the best with a bad role doesn't take away that its a bad role
SirAmelio
about 6 years
i mean

point 1 is just a vent strategy it doesn't make the role good it just helps you to not be terrible

point 2 is easily countered by self-quoting, and in sandbox setups it won't even help you get a CC

point 3 again only helps you to not be terrible

point 4 again can be easily countered by self-quoting although it is a smart use of the role if subtle enough

point 5 see point 3

point 6 very very circumstancial in sandbox, could be good though

point 7 only really helps to contact non-meeting partners without risking a leak, or if the town is stupid enough to claim to them for some reason


vent is B- at most


from what i see in the blog, its a blog mostly for danganmafia in which more often than not they play open roles, thus some of the strategies do fit them a bit better, but again, most of the things are easily countered
Shwartz99
about 6 years
Vent is insanely good and can win games single-handedly. It can contact partners and cause such commotion that nobody will know who is saying what and what is true/false. Should be A tier if not S

More info on the most OP role in the game here: http://epicmafiakuzuryuu.tumblr.com/post/50563934411/role-guide-ventriloquist
verumbark
about 6 years

SirAmelio says

im more interested on why guiser is so high since its only real advantage is escaping if its cornered by a carol/dream/report and managed to survive the lynch (Not saying it's not good, but i dont think its S tier good)


im the reason guiser is s-tier
moonlightseal
about 6 years
Moved spy and vent down from A- to B+

I think everything is good now
SirAmelio
about 6 years
why is vent so high?
deletedabout 6 years
oh wait this probably isn't a tier on how much you like the roles

not bad
deletedabout 6 years
negged the thread immediately once zombie was top tier.
moonlightseal
about 6 years
Changed some tiers for medusa, nomad and baker
SirAmelio
about 6 years

luis4rod says

How is granny not S-tier :thonk:


requires people to visit it, can accidentally prs
luis4rod
about 6 years
How is granny not S-tier :thonk:
deletedabout 6 years
i never knew anyone was so passionate about baker
nearbeer
about 6 years
Ok well since you thought I was joking let me tell you why baker deserves to be B tier:

1) Autoclear almost always.

2) Game doesn't usually end in everyone dying. I have baker probability maxed and I can anecdotally confirm that this is rare. I also don't out bread targets past n1.

3) If you can give out 4 breads, you can have one person with 2 bread, then 3 with 1 bread. This is the best combination for flexibility, as if the person with 2 bread is town, they just have to live for town win (it is probable they are town). If one of the single breaded targets is mafia (probable) then they can scumhunt like normal.

If both of your n1 targets are suspicious, then you might just have to give out to 4 different people.

4) Bread on granny is pretty much insta win. Always funny when it happens.
deletedabout 6 years
crier is boring, asso should be moved up
SirAmelio
about 6 years
i don't get how he'd lead without outing themselves other than basing it on his own scum reads, they still need to be outed to get claims and properly lead
moonlightseal
about 6 years
moving Tinkerer and anar up
crier cần clear himself in jail, and can lead town without outing himself
SirAmelio
about 6 years

baabaa says

creepy girl is literally the best role wtf


its mid-tier at best

assuming players are playing to win and not to fool around, it needs either a n1 win, a gun, or a joint, otherwise it won't win.

One of the easiest 3rds to counter and you don't even need specific roles to do so