Using tools, processes or information outside of a game in a game to reveal the guiser or prove being not guised by anybody else, including but not limited to everything already included in OGI rule.
I am going to put my input in here because charley said guise-testing was not OGI. When I made a report asking for an explanation of why it wasn't OGI, there was no response. Then, I ask more mods to clarify why it isn't OGI. One of them wasn't on in the past 24 hours, the other flat out didn't bother responding.
Here is my argument as to why guise-testing is OGI.
Assume a setup doesn't have a disguiser. Then it is clearly not necessary for one to know another person's personal information or history. I hope I don't need to explain why knowing that information does not actually help in the process of winning the game. Thus, this kind of information is considered outside of the game.
All of a sudden, by having a setup with a disguiser, personal information and history become not outside of the game? If this was considered inside the game, then in the situation without disguiser, it would be the same thing as saying, "I know he's town because his real name is ______".
I am not even going to go into codes because only allowing codes at least gives disguiser a chance to disguise night 1. Although I think it is cheap, it is information that you can create, as long as it is relevant to the game. Without a disguiser, you can use the code to soft your role. With a disguiser, you can do the same thing (which unfortunately also includes proving that you are not disguised). I still think codes are cheap, but because of the way I presented my argument, codes are not OGI.
Please constructively criticize as necessary.
deletedover 7 years
not always.
also Caroline wtf you got me banned, and it wasn't even GT what the hell?
How come 15 users have voted for removing guiser setups from comp, but none of them (including their public alts) have ever got to get a single guiser achievement?
deletedover 7 years
I like you a lot because you go out of your way to make me feel like one of the best players ever when I'm feeling down, but you are way way wrong about this
If there was no guise testing then it would be so easy for mafia. If guiser is smart and works hard they can pull it off. And it will not be easy always. It doesn't have to be. So stop crying about it.
You've only been here since 2013. You probably can't even conceptualize what this site was like before mods.
It hasn't even occurred to you that the rule OGI that came after the role Disguiser wasn't meant to cover or moderate how people use the Disguiser role. Moderating interactions between players that relate to the game aka asking people questions to discover if they're disguised is the exact opposite of OGI, and the point your side continually neglects when make your arguments.
No rule can restrict your knowledge, just how you apply it. How is doubling down on this moronic application the solution to your problem? Also working as intended.
The poll doesn't reflect any form of bias at all. "guise as noobs" is a serious alternative to the viewpoints presented by the OP.
deletedover 7 years
Why is there another forum on this? Pretty sure whoever made the last one got rejected hard. Like others have stated, guise tests can't really count as ogi since you naturally learn sh1t about someone as you play w/ them more. I do agree that stuff that isn't public information isn't fair, but that shouldn't count as OGI.
Separate the rule from the role and the problem is solved. Trying to ban the role or double down on the rule is moronic and doesn't nothing but help casual players be more casual.
datguiser that's a terrible idea. that's inefficient and just plain stupid. I like guy's idea though
deletedover 7 years
why not just have the mods fix that in ranked?
also, interesting idea: an anon round where everybody has different decks, and instead of saying the names, you have to choose the names in order to say them, and it translates to the respective thing for the other person's deck.
For example: DatGuiser and NutellaSquad play together in comp. DatGuiser has "Fruits" deck, and NutellaSquad has "Fufu" deck. DatGuiser has to press on Orange, which on NutellaSquad's device will translate to Knifufu, etc, etc.
this way, people would have to be very skilled at cheating, and have to be in the same IP address in order to communicate effectively.
good idea, but mods probs dont want to spend that long on it, but this does take away the meta portion of it.
I've been here since 2013 and didn't start playing guiser right away.
Also, if you reread, you'll now notice I said people want to KEEP guise tests etc... which shows the CURRENT situation. It doesn't matter if it was or wasn't the same before. I also added something, so it's easier for you to understand what I said (in case it wasn't already):
If you're talking about me, guiser is probably my favourite role (along with mastermind, I'd say, at least talking about scum-sided roles). But you can't just have a role that lets you be ANYONE (even a clear) and then, to compensate that, let the other side test with questions OUTSIDE THE GAME. That's not PART OF THE GAME.
Of course you can test, but the mafs can have the chance to defend themselves, or there is no sense in having the role.
If you out a code and only you can solve it, why have guiser in first place? It just ruins the role...
It's because casual ideas like this that make life easier for casuals and mods are the only ideas that get traction. They were making the same stupid arguments about guns.
The way people are answering to this thread (wanting to keep guise tests with outside of game stuff allowed etc) and the vots (related to the answers) shows (in part) the current situation on EM.
People prefer outing personal info and ogi to win, than to play according to the rules. And when asked, the answer is:
"Forbid guiser in comp" or "guise in new people" and not "punish who goes against the rules".
It SHOULD bring to many more vios... because people OGI A LOT, but it's left unpunished almost always...
Those questions should never be made, bc THEY ARE OGI. The kind of tests that should be allowed are role-related / game-related, not outside of the game-related (how was the movie yesterday?)
I do know some players outside of the game, but don't use that to test them when guised... or some could never be guised, simply...
