If the guy who made the setup is literally telling you that zero thought went into creating it and it's basically a coin flip, it probably is.
deletedover 9 years
As the creator of YYC, the top player on S&L, and the third top player on STBS I hereby declare the setup that I created a garbage random meshing of roles that happens to be balanced in the same way coin-flipping is balanced.
deletedover 9 years
I think the creator of a setup should be able to deem it unfit for competitive play. Seems like the creator would probably know best how the setup is supposed to be played, and whether or not it is propitious to actual thinking or not (it's not)
to me stuff like this is about using inference and judgment. I don't think it's hard to make case-by-case solutions to make things better for everyone. If a lot of people complain about it, then something is probably wrong and mods should have the power to fix that.
I wouldn't say it's random if you use reason and judgment. Again this becomes about trusting the people in charge. A lot of people don't which is why there are issues, and to be fair some mods make poor decisions on this kind of stuff.
I personally like a setup shortlist, but I know that would stifle creativity way more than it should be, but at the very least you'd ensure that the setups listed are what people can expect to play and are all universally well-regarded. I'm thinking of like how the Smash community picks which stages they allow. There's an accepted list and then the host can tweak things as they see fit, and even the outliers are labeled as 'could be okay depending on host', essentially. The mods could do something like that but I doubt it'd be worth the effort to do so.
Fixing the site meta isn't my MO here, it's more about preventing a bad role/setup from being allowed.
I'm not trying to push around mods I just want to see what consensus is here.
I don't think it's arbitrary, I just think mods should be able to have greater say when managing the competition. That's why getting a group consensus on this stuff is good. I know I have extreme opinions on some of this stuff, but any good leader can compromise.
You just need to trust mods to make informed decisions and involve the community. There have been a few gaffes lately, but to be fair Jasper isn't really a comp enthusiast so it's not as much of a concern for him as it was for me.
every time I've played YYC people are always amazed that the mods allow it.
deletedover 9 years
pranay likes the role fiddler because anytime he gets fiddled he doesn't need to listen to other peoples fos' he just needs to bark out reads without actually reading the game
I'm not mad I just think it's lame and bad for a number of reasons. I get your perspective, Pranay, but I think you look at it in a black or white way (like almost everyone who disagrees with me on this kind of stuff). Fiddler is not the same as Lawyer, Stalker, or any role you mentioned.
Fiddler disrupts communication in a fundamental way that is ill-suited for a competition. The other roles are deceptive and cause confusion, but you can make an educated decision because you can still read all the content given to decipher it. Fiddler disallows you from reading the text of the game which defeats the purpose of even playing in the first place.
I'd like to play the other setups, but a lot of the time they won't fill. I don't play a ton of games anymore, that's true, but I don't really feel the need to delve into my personal situation. I play when I feel like it, and it's nice to be able to join a quality table of a playable setup when the mood strikes me at least.
I created the setup. There is no secret avenue to critical thinking intricately embedded in the combination of roles. It's a garbage setup made by a 15 year old who liked guns and fiddler.
And if you want a different setup with nilla then go ahead and make it.
If all you want to do is fix setups then go and play the same fixed setup. You cry about balancing setups when setups don't need balancing. Every setup is different. All you have in your dumb head is that you should fix every setup and bring it down to the same old setup. Why did you not play when vdli was comped. idiot whining about irrelevant things all the time.
i have never seen a more stupid person on this site. You are dumb to think that it disallows communication. It just another challenge to communicate without having the proper tools. It is what separates the noobs from the pros. I am sure you had a miserable experience with fiddler and that is why you want it out. Just like you had a bad experience with A&D and you want it out. You refuse to see the wide variety of challenges that this role brings into the game. It is a mafia role designed to paralyze the town. Next you will cry that we should remove the lawyer because it gives false reports to the cop.
Then you will cry that we should remove stalker because it helps mafia know the roles of town members. You require proper skills to use the fiddler role to your advantage as both the town and maf.
When you are fiddled it is absolutely simple to communicate. Moreover you can be cleared if there is only one killing mafia and the correct kills is made.
You can confuse the town when you are mafia. You get so mad about this role when you do not even play so much.
Why don't you just shove it up your and play the other 5 setups if you don't like this role.
deletedover 9 years
i've literally only played 4 games of comp in the last 2 days because I refuse to play this crappy setup and it's nearly impossible to get a decent table in any other setup.
deletedover 9 years
I mean people say the community/ site changed, this setup is proof that the community is still the same. It's been 25 months and everyone still agrees that this setup SUCKS
deletedover 9 years
deleted 15mon 8d +2 this setup is so bad, if i were sonseray i'd feel bad for even making it.
deletedover 9 years
I created YYC, and as Dr. Frankenstein let me just say: Burn it with fire.
