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DDP - How to play it for noobs (and

GuyFawkes85
about 7 years

not noobs) AND WHY MIMICKING N1 IS GT

The post is going to be long, you can find a Tl;dr at the end.

N1: tracker tracks, drunk should NO DRUNK because of no jan and to avoid wasting the ml (above all on mimic), mimic should no mimic (since mimicking n1 is gt - explaining it below)

D1: prs out in this order: tracker - drunk - bomb - MIMIC HIDES

N2: tracker tracks - drunk only drunks if mimic was outed (fished or bw'd) otherwise he NO DRUNKS to avoid being on mimic

D2: hopefully you were good enough to hit maf and still have the ml, use it, otherwise you're on lylo, reread, scumhunt, THINK and then lynch

then move from there

USUAL OBJECTIONS

  1. You have a drunk, why no drunk? You can stop jan!

You only have 1/8 of hitting jan, and maf no jans most of the time. If they no jan and you're on town, you're wasting a ml (and if it's on mimic you also lose you're most precious pr, AND THEN DRUNK TOO) SO NO DRUNK, DO NOT BE STUPID

  1. I will mimic n1, because I'm pro and I will be on pr, I, do what I want, I'm a rebel!

No, you're not a rebel, you're a gt alt / gt main, because you are going against your win condition and intentionally! (AND MODS KNOW THAT, Idk why they no vio it!) DO NOT MIMIC N1!!! IT IS GT (AND ALSO BAD PLAY)

N1 you have 33% of being on a pr, 33% of being on a blue and 33% of being on maf. N2 you have 100% of being on a pr, after they claim. By mimicking n1, you are going AGAINST YOUR WIN CONDITION. STOP GT'ING.

TL;DR; Mimicking n1 = autovio because against your win condition AND intentional / Drunking n1 is still really bad, even if not gt

Mimicking n1 autovio
4 signed
Yes Yes Yes
GuyFawkes85
Volta
Bookkeeper
Orienteering
Make mimicking n1 autovio
4
Yes
3
Yes
dzanek1143
about 7 years

GuyFawkes85 says

1. You confirm him, but still YOU won't be clear, only tracker
2. Town always outs all prs, so that point isn't valid (because they're bad, not your fault)
3. Tracker confirming your visit (if you out first) doesn't make him clear, because his report can be fake
4. Depends on how mafia claims drunk
5. You don't clear anyone of being jan, in case of no jan
6. That's 1/8 (of you being on ninja) x 1/8 (of maf hitting bomb) = 1/64 chances - DEFINITELY not worth it
7. ???
8. That's the worst case scenario and the MAIN reason not to drunk


1. You clear tracker and this might be enough, as drunk kill is more valuable for mafia.
2. Depending the table and the drunk. They may focus on lynching the drunk tracker claim. If wrong, they still have confirmed mafia and drunk can drink confirmed maf to prevent jan or guise out.
3. Mafia being lucky about your visit is 1/64. On top of that, no mafia fakes drunk visit on town. People townread the tracker claim who found drunk visit along with the drunk, as long as they both aren't cc'd. If they are, they usually lynch their cc, therefore drunk can be mimicked and town can fight for auto by drinking the last mafia.
4. Drunk jan'd = claim drunk. Tracker nv on dead = drunk being clear. It's enough for another mafia to fish for mimic then guise into the mimic so they both become clear and town is led into autoloss.
5. If there's jan, you clear. About non-janning I mentioned in the last paragraph.
6. This is still something than nothing. Also, it's 1/63 chance of drinking ninja (1/9) who kills the bomb (1/7). Also, on jan kill bomb you know the jan'd role (clearing other pr's) and reveal ninja for potential auto, as you drink for the last mafia.
7. If you roleblocked ninja, there's maf kill on bomb, so roleblocked uncc'd bomb claim can't be ninja.
8. What's wrong with roleblocking mimic? Mimic confirms you and the mimic has chance to mimic N2 as it's supposed to be played.
Craz
about 7 years
44% of being on PR or Jan
11% of Tracker on you
11% of Drunk on you
20% of Jan claiming NV on you
11% of getting killed N1 (jan doesn't know mimic died)

It's optimal for drunk to drunk and mimic to mimic N1.
maite03
about 7 years
It's a high risk, high reward play. When it works, it works very well.
JM123
about 7 years
yay
GuyFawkes85
about 7 years
I have just reread the game. Yes, you did gt.
JM123
about 7 years
did I gt? bc i have 2 active gt vios, cant affoard a third one
JM123
about 7 years
tl dr but after takin a look at this thread i went to play and rolled mimic, mimicked n1 for the lolz, turned bomb and won the game

https://epicmafia.com/game/6235795
deletedabout 7 years

ecliptic says

There is such a thing as taking a risk to give yourself an advantage. For e.g. mimicking n1, so that if mafia tries to cc mimic, they will be confirmed as scum. Or vig shooting n1 in reverse mafia to remove traitors from the game.

If you want to outlaw gambits then we might as well move over to Town of Salem.


There is no advantage to mimicing N1 on the off chance that you copy a PR compared to the amount of wins that holding the mimic and copying the drunk will give you. It's statistically much better.
jess
about 7 years
hi joga :)
deletedabout 7 years
STOP GT'ING
GuyFawkes85
about 7 years
N1

3 chances of being on blue = 33%
3 chances of being on mafia = 33%
3 chances of being on pr = 33%

N2, after prs claimed

100% of being either on real pr or maf claiming it

STOP GT'ING

Drunk doesn't drunk n1 (bc of no jan)
If tracker finds you visiting (above all dead) n1, you are not mimic read
If you are on pr, you got LUCKY, you weren't good
If you were on jan (the only mafia who ccs) you were EVEN MORE LUCKY.

STOP GT'ING
FoolishCop
about 7 years
Mimicing N1 it's going against my win condition. I can mimic the dead and confirm PRs. I can Mimic the Jan who CCs a PR. I can mimic a PR to confirm a PR. Tracker can track me to confirm me. Drunk can drunk me and I can confirm him. If Jan Jan's me then they don't know that I was mimic. Either they think I was blue or the PR I mimiced and that PR can claim mimiced.

It's risk/reward. Not GTing.
GuyFawkes85
about 7 years
Removing traitors from the game in reverse helps mafia, since it's less people masons can mason and more chances of masoning nilla. - unless masons mismasoned n1, in which case it could be justified, to reduce the difference in numbers.

Mimicking n1 is just gt, not a risk, because prs still out d1, and it outs mimic too. It can make jan useless in case they no jan, but doesn't help with cc, and you have 66% of being on NON-PR and 33% only of being on pr, vs 100% (exactly 100%) of being on either pr or fake pr if you do it on n2.

FACT.

---

I hope you move to ToS soon, now.
ecliptic
about 7 years
There is such a thing as taking a risk to give yourself an advantage. For e.g. mimicking n1, so that if mafia tries to cc mimic, they will be confirmed as scum. Or vig shooting n1 in reverse mafia to remove traitors from the game.

If you want to outlaw gambits then we might as well move over to Town of Salem.
GuyFawkes85
about 7 years
Going against your win condition is already clear. But the vios being given (or not given) aren't consistent with the rule.

The rules can be revised, but what's more important they HAVE TO BE ENFORCED (FOR EVERYONE).
deletedabout 7 years
At this rate there should just be a revise of the rules, give examples and make them almost perfectly clear so no one argue against them.
GuyFawkes85
about 7 years
At 1 day from the end of the round, you don't assume people don't know how the setup works... And the ones I'm reporting (since you mods warned me you might report me of report abuse) ALL KNEW IT, so yeah, that's still GT.

And how do people who just join the game know the other rules? They'll know this one the same way. Add it to the "Rules" page.
jess
about 7 years
think about it from another perspective though. what if someone doesnt know the setup that well? what if its a new player? and they mimic n1, does that mean its GT?
if someone mimics n1 and then goes on to say the next day " i did this just to troll you guys" okay then yeah maybe thats GT

but its not automatically GT lol, GT needs intent and not everyone knows its not optimal
GuyFawkes85
about 7 years
@LazyYami GOING INTENTIONALLY AGAINST YOUR WIN CONDITION = GT

"Intentionally playing against your win condition or not playing to win."


VIG SHOOTING N1:

Shooting mafia n1 and making the game unranked = no use to anyone

Shooting any other role = no use to town (since they are either town or mason targets)

How does it go in favor of your win condition? Please tell me.

And it's intentional.

----

Fungunning, as said, depends on setup and cases. if you can gun a clear and gun outside, that's PLAIN GT. (Goes against your win condition, since you can give a free gun to mafia, waste a gun or ml and even lose the game if it's on lylo)
deletedabout 7 years
Tbh vig shooting n1 in reverse counting as gt is stupid, the odds you hit mason/stalker are so low. I can understand it being trolling tho. Same thing with fun gunning, if you gun your tr and they flip maf you still played towards your win condition by gunning your tr. The biggest problem with gt is most people see a bad play and immediately call it gt.
GuyFawkes85
about 7 years
I can see this being a new Jan 2.0 (unfortunately), so I wouldn't get my hopes up, if I were you, trekker.
deletedabout 7 years
towns chances drastically go down if you mimic n1

but am looking forward to this never being comp again after this
GuyFawkes85
about 7 years
Fungunning can IN CERTAIN SITUATIONS be pro your win condition, but very rarely so. Depends on the setup, on if you have a ml or not, etc.

So I ask again, in which situations?
GuyFawkes85
about 7 years
Shooting n1 in reverse mafia isn't gt just because the game goes unranked if you hit mafia (which is the one you have to hit).

Hitting the other ones is AGAINST your win condition, since they're all mason targets, so it SHOULD be GT. The fact mods don't vio it (or people don't report it) is another pair of shoes.
GuyFawkes85
about 7 years

Giga13 says

Whether mimicing n1 is GT is the same concept as fungunning or vig shooting n1; none of these are gt


In which situation?