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the concept of banning

cub
over 7 years

you know whats a cool thing to think about

everymod's favorite hobby, banning people

so here's the paradox: you ban people so that they can't cause trouble, correct? so, they come back on an alt and don't cause any trouble, but you discover that they're a "banned user," so you ban them again. but wait, why ban them if they aren't causing trouble? and why are they even a "banner user" if they aren't causing trouble?

i think that permanent and even simply long bans are illogical because at some point in a ban someone will inevitably reach a point where they stop bothering to cause trouble. otherwise they could just use vpns forever. really, banning serves only to inconvenience people who are least dedicated to causing trouble and challenge (unsuccessfully) those who aren't

so we should abolish banning users for longer than a month and exterminate the concept of a "banned user" which is redundant considering once an alt starts causing trouble you can ban them on that premise anyway so why does it matter

cub
over 7 years
https://oup.silverchair-cdn.com/oup/backfile/Content_public/Journal/jpubhealth/27/2/10.1093/pubmed/fdi011/2/fdi011.pdf?Expires=1493348673&Signature=cLOAsV1EJ4L6mVmi3FUbgbpChrqIjbIYyl194rC56dqTCUG6bKVPom419~aKRfF1Z2jKIcV7nxe5D38gHIZ~EfoepRQ53rz8CNiR1Gri~NbSAALuB95aH9t~R0MoNmAOm1qVsC~JolTSTOQ9do6Wcj8buzSoUdYaOWoVSecDMJ3HrglU4ZRZiEfubi8ZoaU6hRX5MHici8r7KvI~uhEPFubIB8vCvvWlddNiRHFRktgPmowAS3ty6pZ2bmAJ2I90h8B~hZ3c0uvX5crR-eBWgbiL7vW8xiVpXpWTbaC7-QC-HetH0vutAkbiCFshXWhUF7lp0jGVDl7JGoE17lLB0Q__&Key-Pair-Id=APKAIUCZBIA4LVPAVW3Q
xxerox
over 7 years
In africa they cut off your hands if you steal.

That stops them from stealing ever again.

Do you think that is effective or ineffective?
xxerox
over 7 years
You do something bad.

You are punished.

You get negative association and reaction toward the bad thing you did.

You are now negative toward the bad thing and never do it again because you will be punished again and you will feel bad.
cub
over 7 years

UltraAug says


thelastchromosome says


baabaa says

why would they care to learn if they aren't punished?


that isn't learning that's just conditioning most of the literature on prison systems shows its not effective


i need a .gov or .edu source

pass the bleach



http://lmgtfy.com/?q=punishment+psychology
cub
over 7 years

baabaa says

why would they care to learn if they aren't punished?


well if you want to put it that way, let's talk about punishment psychology

punishment creates a negative association, typically to the thing you're punishing a subject for, rather than a positive association towards acceptable behavior. what this means is that you get a very targeted reform (if you punish someone from stealing, it does nothing to stop them from being violent as would respect for others' persons) and, as you would expect from negative association, a negative reaction, such as becoming more hostile than they otherwise would over pricing when they really want something but have a strong negative reaction to stealing.
UltraAug
over 7 years

thelastchromosome says


baabaa says

why would they care to learn if they aren't punished?


that isn't learning that's just conditioning most of the literature on prison systems shows its not effective


i need a .gov or .edu source

pass the bleach
deletedover 7 years

thelastchromosome says


baabaa says

why would they care to learn if they aren't punished?


that isn't learning that's just conditioning most of the literature on prison systems shows its not effective


for learning
deletedover 7 years

baabaa says

why would they care to learn if they aren't punished?


that isn't learning that's just conditioning most of the literature on prison systems shows its not effective
baabaa
over 7 years
why would they care to learn if they aren't punished?
UltraAug
over 7 years

cub says


UltraAug says


cub says

you don't care if people learn, you only want to punish them


will they not learn if they are punished?



you says

it doesn't matter if they got reformed in 20 minutes





people will abuse this system

they knew the rules

even if they are reformed they aren't a special snowflake

they should have known better to begin with

they may learn from the punishment, yes, by serving their time

of course i want to punish them, but it's not like i was like "hey i really don't like that guy"

they did it to themselves.
Cody
over 7 years
u can learn without being punished
cub
over 7 years

UltraAug says


cub says

you don't care if people learn, you only want to punish them


will they not learn if they are punished?



you says

it doesn't matter if they got reformed in 20 minutes

xxerox
over 7 years

cub says

you don't care if people learn, you only want to punish them


Saddly yes.

If they knew better, they would never have done anything bad in the first place. Or not purposly trying to do it again and again and again.


Learning and reform is for those that did something small or something not so bad.
deletedover 7 years
from the opinion of a banned user of 5 years
it never fking matters whether or not a banned user is banned or not
UltraAug
over 7 years

cub says

you don't care if people learn, you only want to punish them


will they not learn if they are punished?

and lol you couldn't answer my question nice
cub
over 7 years
you don't care if people learn, you only want to punish them
cub
over 7 years
so it isn't about reform, it's about vindication
UltraAug
over 7 years
it doesn't matter if they got reformed in 20 minutes; if someone like this got unbanned early, wouldn't all the other banned people (including the unreformed ones) say "hey guys i'm reformed unban me"

is there really a way to tell who is reformed and who isn't? if so, explain it. i wanna hear
UltraAug
over 7 years

cub says

if banning is meant to reform, then why would you ban an alt of a banned user who isn't causing trouble

isn't that reformed


it doesn't matter if they aren't causing trouble. they did what they did to get banned; now they need to serve their time

they knew the rules beforehand.
cub
over 7 years

xxerox says

Prison is there to punish people, not reform.

I personally think for murder you should stay in prison forever, or at least just talk with them online and never in person.


it isn't actually, but yes this is what vindictive people think
cub
over 7 years

UltraAug says


cub says


UltraAug says

is this a troll thread

i can't tell

also just banning the banned user again would be a lot simpler than waiting every single time


the mindset of the salem witch trials

sure, they aren't summoning satan... YET


no, but they already "summoned satan" beforehand. that's the problem


you should be focusing your energy on satan then
cub
over 7 years
if banning is meant to reform, then why would you ban an alt of a banned user who isn't causing trouble

isn't that reformed
UltraAug
over 7 years

cub says


UltraAug says

is this a troll thread

i can't tell

also just banning the banned user again would be a lot simpler than waiting every single time


the mindset of the salem witch trials

sure, they aren't summoning satan... YET


no, but they already "summoned satan" beforehand. that's the problem
UltraAug
over 7 years

cub says


UltraAug says

mafia games are like murder


well if you want me to get really controversial here: if they went however many years without committing crime, do they seem reformed? that's what prison is supposed to do: reform people. if they're reformed, what do they need to be in prison for?

the answer isn't because they belong in prison, the answer is a mix of vindication and protecting an image


let's see if i understand what u said

>prison reforms people

isn't banning supposed to reform people too; keep them off the website until they know better; kick their alts off because they are supposed to be kicked off the site thinking about what they have done

of course prisoners eventually serve their time; so do banned users. they both aren't supposed to avoid it though.

or maybe i misinterpreted what you said completely
xxerox
over 7 years
Prison is there to punish people, not reform.

I personally think for murder you should stay in prison forever, or at least just talk with them online and never in person.