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The Sims Method to Tryharding

over 9 years

at mafia.

I'm Sims, aliases LetzShake & Shacky, alternate accounts Jupiter and Aesop. I play mafia. I also win at mafia. Sometimes I even moderate mafia. I'm writing this guide because I'm a mentor and I feel the need to spread my knowledge. This guide is meant for players of all skill levels, but only for ranked and competitive play. If you like this guide, shoot me 20 tokens.

There are many aspects to mafia. The town play and the mafia, play for starters. Playing as the town and as the mafia makes up the most important part of the game. How you play as town and mafia, though, sets apart the good players from the great players, and the great players from the bad players.

Universal tips.

Every single good player you will ever come across will tell you that being confident is the most important part of mafia. That's why I don't want to go too into detail about it. At the end of the day, being confident in your reads will be what makes you a good player. The reads don't have to be right. In fact, they'll be wrong more often than not. That's the nature of the game, but that doesn't matter.

Crypto goes over this extensively in the guide he wrote a couple of years ago. Being confident in your reads doesn't mean that you should never change them. You should constantly be reevaluating your reads and looking for new tells, but be confident in the reads that you do have. On top of that, never let someone pressure you into voting the opposite person. Vote someone because of your reads, not because of the pressure.

That was all really self explanatory and Crypto went over it extensively, which is why I'm glossing over it. Something that I think is just as important is your game presence. Don't be afraid to take control of the game, but don't be obnoxious. Most good players that you'll see will type a lot more than the rest. This isn't a coincidence. If you have something to say, say it. Don't pre-write your lines, you'll come off as forced, whether you're town or mafia. Play Epic Mafia like you would play Mafia in real life. Talk to the other people in the game as if you were face to face. This isn't forum mafia so you don't have the time to pre-plan everything you say, and you should take advantage of that as both town or mafia.

That has a lot to do with natural charisma. If you type as if it's a stream of consciousness and you don't hold anything back, people will be more likely to listen to you. They'll gravitate towards your reads and you'll come off as genuine. Personally, I think this is the most important part of playing as both town and mafia, and I also think it's what new players struggle with the most. It's the biggest hurdle to overcome as a player, because if you're in a room with players more experienced with you, you'll most likely be intimidated. You'll eventually find your voice over time, but learning to speak up is a huge step to becoming good. I want to stress this, though. Don't be obnoxious, don't caps lock when you don't need to, and don't be annoying.

Town play

That's about as far as I'll go with universal mafia tips. Anything that I haven't gone over, you can probably find in Crypto's guide.

I want to preface this section by saying I hate reaction testing. Reaction testing sucks, and any decent player will be able to react accordingly. If you're reading this guide you are probably (hopefully) playing gold heart games, and in gold heart games you'll be playing with players that will know how to react accordingly. Just don't do it, you'll get bad reads. I want to spend most of this section talking about my scumhunting process. Everyone's is different. It might take you a while to find your own, or if you're an experienced player already and reading this to see my perspective, you've already found your own. The way I scumhunt has changed pretty radically over the duration I've been playing this game.

Originally, I was a very socratic player. I would ask a bunch of questions regarding people's reads and I would try to deduce the mafia from there. I was very analytical, and I would read into every single detail. I can't stand this method. I don't think it helps, and while I was doing it, I don't think I was a good player. It might work for some people, but it didn't work for me, and I can't seriously recommend that playstyle. It works for some players such as SystemOverload and projectmatt (both good players), but I personally think that if you read into every single detail you're bound to trip yourself up.

I much prefer the Sims Scumhunting Method. The reason why I prefer the Sims Scumhunting Method is because it involves weeding out the BS. I guess my scumhunting style is pretty rigid, but it works, and I think it's way better than being over-analytical. For starters, if you any good player, 9 times out of 10 they'll say getting townreads are easier and more reliable than getting scumreads. They're right. If somebody says something townie, don't ignore it. I remember a few years back, I was in a game of O2R, and I was townread by Crypto for saying one line that I definitely wouldn't say as mafia. Yeah, that's a weird thing to remember, but it stuck with me, and it's a good mentality. Sometimes town players will drop a line that is either way too genuine, well thought out, or maybe just flat out dumb enough that they're undeniably town.

Actually scumhunting is a lot more difficult than town-hunting. This should be obvious. If the mafia aren't trying to act like a town, they aren't doing their job. It's your job to decipher which players are actually town and which are trying to act like town. That's how the game of mafia works. A huge part of actually scumhunting is deciding if someone is genuine. That's a pretty vague statement, though. You need to decide if someone speaks genuinely and if their reads are genuine.

Even though a part of scumhunting is deciding if someone is speaking genuinely, I don't recommend using it as the basis for your reads. Any half decent mafia player will be able to speak with a genuine tone. I went over it in the paragraph I wrote about game presence. Genuineness is a tool to use as both town and mafia, and the mafia will most certainly use it.

The other part of scumhunting is deciding if a player's reads are genuine. Look at their explanations, their voting patterns, and when they vote. Look for holes in someone's explanations of their reads. A lot of the time the mafia will either overcompensate with their explanations and start making stuff up, or they won't commit enough and barely provide any reasoning. I can't really describe what makes a player's reads good or bad because it's mostly subjective. That's especially true in 3 way lylos where the mafia can pretty much make up reasoning because it's all retrospective. As the game goes on, I prefer to look at what's already there as opposed to what the people in lylo are actually saying. Look for partner interactions, bad tunnels, and stuff like that. The less room for interpretation a tell has, the better. You want to look for tells that scream “no blue would ever do/say this.” That goes for partner tells, too.

Another large part of being town is towntelling. Crypto goes over that in his guide, so I'll keep this part short. Read what I said about game presence over again. Play like you're talking to the other players face to face. Use your natural charisma.

Mafia play

I've already written a lot and I'm getting tired, so I want to keep this short. Play mafia as if you were town. A lot of people will tell you to emulate your town play, but instead of emulating your town play, just play as if you were town. Create reads that you would if you were town. Push on the town's scumreads. I would say mafia is the more difficult role to play, but you're allowed to get away with a lot more.

If you really want to improve your mafia game, start focus on being natural. I know I said don't emulate your town play, but if you aren't confident in your mafia play, that's how you should start. I say this because after a while, acting like a town will come naturally. It takes a lot of practice to nail down your mafia play. You need to strive to be unreadable. Don't give the town any information, and whatever information you do give, make sure it's hard to read into. Don't be afraid to interact with your partner, don't be afraid to make up some reads (as long as they're believable), and don't be afraid to point out your own towntells.

Also, as a rule of thumb, whenever I out a read as mafia, I always make sure that I have a reason to back it up with, regardless of whether or not I out the reason. It's a good way to practice making sure you have reasons as mafia, and if someone asks you for your reasoning you won't be screwed.

How to improve

I guess you could say this entire guide would be how to improve, but it will only get you so far. Like I said, I started off as an absolutely awful player, but I improved over time enough to the point where I can call myself good at the least. The way I improved was by playing with players that were better than me and recreating what I saw. I learned from like Crypto (who I mentioned multiple times and wrote the guide I referenced), Soben, and Maxwell, but I wouldn't say they taught me how to play. You should always be looking to improve. Play with better players and learn from them. You'll eventually find your own play style and mix what you learned from them with your own habits, and you'll be a better player for it.

if you liked it, give me 20 tokens
7 signed
shoot me a $5 donation, kickstarter style
over 9 years
whats it like being a passiveaggressive teen
over 9 years
Slow trying to be funny. Attempt failed.

Sims already used this... "joke", I guess? I believe it was aposomething thread about trophy club.

Anyways, bye guys, I had some nice conversations with you all. :)
deletedover 9 years

gifty says

Lol, what?

As someone who does not suck as mafia alignment I can tell you that your mafia guide is very poor. You gave obvious tips.

I won't comment on town part for obvious reasons. : )


wait, you have a trophy????????? where is it? O__O
over 9 years
Owen I wanted to put you too, but I realized you're not a bad player, but rather an upset child. :)
deletedover 9 years
Man, PandaClaus has gone off the deep end.
over 9 years
nothing like some pandaclaus foolishness to get you EM nostalgic
over 9 years
really? i don't think most EM users have a massive crylist on their profile
over 9 years
man, gifty's profile is a great read
over 9 years

Apostasy says

Gifty you'll probably never trophy again (definitely not on a real setup, haha) and you definitely won't ever get a higher scum win rate than me but I am envious of that 66% third party win rate. I don't even HAVE a third party win rate, how do I get one???


Who the hell are you? o_O


As for the question - play Reverse.

@Rutab
I used to think SuperNova is good (for like 1 week), I've never considered you even a decent player. :)

@anime
I am nice compared to most EM users.
over 9 years
he seems like an unpleasant person
deletedover 9 years
It's okay, gifty is a bad mafia player and his opinion is about as valuable as maymay's.
deletedover 9 years
Pandaclaus once told me he thought Supernova and I were the best EpicMafia players on this website (lmao) and now I'm in his HOF for being bad
deletedover 9 years
Gifty you'll probably never trophy again (definitely not on a real setup, haha) and you definitely won't ever get a higher scum win rate than me but I am envious of that 66% third party win rate. I don't even HAVE a third party win rate, how do I get one???
deletedover 9 years
Just so everyone knows, gifty is pandaclaus and he is a big fat joke

https://epicmafia.com/user/374871/statistics
deletedover 9 years

gifty says


TweIve says


gifty says


TweIve says

Gifty makes bad posts, in a good thread.


you are dellusional if you think his tips to playing as mafia are useful.


Yeah, I believe that you could learn a thing or two from it, bad mafia player gifty.


What can we learn: as mafia you need to play like you are town.

It's like saying: as town you need to find mafia.

I'm not saying whole thread is bad, I'm saying mafia part is bad. But coming from someone who has trouble playing as mafia - expected. ;)


shut up
over 9 years
It's hard to scumread people, it's really freaking easy to townread people.
over 9 years

Rutab says

Who the heck even is gifty


my alt
deletedover 9 years
Who the heck even is gifty
over 9 years

TweIve says


gifty says


TweIve says

Gifty makes bad posts, in a good thread.


you are dellusional if you think his tips to playing as mafia are useful.


Yeah, I believe that you could learn a thing or two from it, bad mafia player gifty.


What can we learn: as mafia you need to play like you are town.

It's like saying: as town you need to find mafia.

I'm not saying whole thread is bad, I'm saying mafia part is bad. But coming from someone who has trouble playing as mafia - expected. ;)
over 9 years

Goodbar says

while i agree that playing too socratically (?) can ultimately be a hindrance, it's useful in the content it can generate. you ultimately just have to utilize what is relevant and ignore what isn't. i've always felt i played better when interacting more with players in the beginning and using more of a "sims style" approach towards the end when you have to start weighing out relevant information.

i like that you bashed reaction testing because i think most of the time it just sets up scumplayers to towntell and muddies reads. you wind up asking yourself "would [player] do that as town/mafia?" and i think most of the time that's a worse line of thought than "what did [player] do that was town/mafia?"

and i agree that emulating your town playstyle is a bad approach unless you're consistently townread as town, then perhaps it's intuitive. most players aren't going to have a solid meta on you and most that try and use meta get inconsistent results. so i'd focus more on catering to players that are gonna help you win if you show them qualities they think are town-like.


shortly after making this post goodbar went on to hmmm and aaaah for another year when he got hammer
over 9 years

gifty says


TweIve says

Gifty makes bad posts, in a good thread.


you are dellusional if you think his tips to playing as mafia are useful.


Yeah, I believe that you could learn a thing or two from it, bad mafia player gifty.
over 9 years

TweIve says

Gifty makes bad posts, in a good thread.


you are dellusional if you think his tips to playing as mafia are useful.
over 9 years
Gifty makes bad posts, in a good thread.
over 9 years
Lol, what?

As someone who does not suck as mafia alignment I can tell you that your mafia guide is very poor. You gave obvious tips.

I won't comment on town part for obvious reasons. : )
over 9 years
that's called a burn, and it was sick. also don't post in my threads