I have seen so many issues with ISP lately that I want a completely legitimate and serious explanation of what ISP is and how to avoid it. Apostasy's game and report (https://epicmafia.com/topic/64588) is a controversial issue in my opinion and I think he at least deserves a refund.
I also want to mention that I believe the rules on refunding need to change. Refunds are too dependent on the rules of the site and the rules of violations. They need to be related to the specific happening, not by the same basic rules. If Apuleio had paid attention enough to the game, he would have realized that it was autowin and all he had to do was reread and find out that keri was cop. Apeescaper was confirmed mafia had he realized that.
That is where I bring up the report on me. I was recently given a Note (I know it's just a note, but I want to bring up the sudden double standard) that was for ISP. During a game, (only a red-heart) I was clear and I had hammer. As I was rereading, I missed a soft claim made by the cop that one of the people in my 3-way was clear. I was reported and asked to be given an ISP violation. Ladynemesis noted it for ISP. As shown above, a simple issue of rereading should be given no violation according to Apostasy's case. She even warned me that it was just in case it happened again. This is an obvious double standard with the same issue and different verdicts.
What is ISP? I'm not angry about the note, I'm just disappointed since I think this plus the handling of refunds is not good.
Well I'm not sure how in depth pranay wants to be exactly but I do believe it would be difficult, not writing it all but remembering all cases.
Also for example the whole NK issue where the NK is forced would be nice to have a bullet point on, and meteor, and all that stuff for game throwing. However these are things that some mods and players still debate so it would be hard to come with a consensus
there wont be need for any kind of transition as the rules wont be any different from what we already have. and there wont be any part of the rules that people will disagree with. that is how a book of law is written. it is without any flaw.
The worst part about transition would be for anything that's missing after we initially switch to it, but I guess we wouldn't forget about the rules from before. Maybe I'm over exaggerating how different it'd be.
That's a good idea too. The language is super important though. It'd be nice if things were more clearly outlined. It's sort of silly that a lot of the rules are still largely oral traditions and based off reports we can't view games for.
well i am talking about a different kind of document. and leave the organization to me. leave everything to me. just give me few people to work with, else ill be able to prepare it only by tomorrow.
and id need those 5 only to validate the document. not for any other purpose. but if they help me with the document, then even better. may be some people can do it better and faster than me.
Transition wouldn't be difficult, it's just a really daunting task.
I did one for gamethrowing when the mods started but this was before there were even "rules" and at the end people just settled with having brief descriptions that could be interpreted like the ones in the rules page. They definitely should be kept. What I suggest is making a thread for each rule, and after the original brief description you would say "for more information: see x thread". That would be best it's just getting people to write all that would be needed for these rules will take time and effort, plus no offense some mods wouldn't know everything to put there, specifically for the less common rules
the thing is that they are bound by precedence. they have dealt several reports like this and it was not refunded, and despite it being refund worthy, if they refund it for you, they will face problems.
Codification of the rules system would make everything easier and more objective. It's just a really daunting task and transition will be difficult, but it's a great idea and I've been all about it for a while.
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This game could decide whether I get bronze or silver so I implore you to refund it! This is what ISP by negligence was made for.
hey rutab, may be we can discuss this properly and come up with a solution. in this thread it will just be spam.
instead of asking a question here, we should come up with a proposal and make a thread.
if you would like to discuss it with me, i will be available on skype after 3 hours. pm me your skype. i think i have the comprehensive solution for such cases. and i do think sonseray deserves a refund here, but the moderator staff is in a very bad situation here. they cant be sure whether to refund or not, given the guidelines they have from lucid and the precedents set. if they refund it, they might face several attacks from others, and if they do not they may face the same. so i think its unfair for the inexperienced team to be put in this situation. they need a proper set of rules, so that they do not have ambiguous situations.
i think it is time the rules were written comprehensively like in a book of law, and that the moderators followed the rules properly.
i can come up with a document which can cover all cases, and even the cases where someone can be excused.
but i will need some help from the vets. if the rules are defined properly, and are followed without need of precedents, then there wont be any fights about the moderation.
all we need is a comprehensive and an exhaustive documentation of rules which should be read by people.
we cant expect all the new joinees to read it, so once they get reported, they should be encouraged to read the rules.
or once they get to a particular stage or they start playing gold hearts, or some point where we can all agree upon, then we can expect someone to know all the rules.
An Internet service provider (ISP) is an organization that provides services for accessing, using, or participating in the Internet. Internet service providers may be organized in various forms, such as commercial, community-owned, non-profit, or otherwise privately owned.
Internet services typically provided by ISPs include Internet access, Internet transit, domain name registration, web hosting, colocation.
