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Tips for Making Effective Roles

over 7 years

Lucid has once again returned to us, and subsequently has brought a bunch of new roles into play. Many people have ideas for roles they think should get added, but only a few are going to ever make it into the game officially. This is a guide to making new, interesting, and unique roles that will benefit the game.

To start, let's look at some existing roles and see what makes them good. The Villager and Mafia are pretty self explanatory. Without those two roles, there would be no game. Indeed, one could play a game with only those two roles.

Roles get interesting with the idea of power roles, which are roles with night actions. These are also the most suggested kinds of roles. The most famous of these are the Cop and the Doctor. In almost any version of mafia, you will always find a version of these two roles. The town has two objectives in a game: to find the mafia and to stay alive. The Cop and Doctor do these things by each specializing in one thing. The Cop is very good at finding the mafia. The Doctor is good at keeping people alive. Simple roles like these are very good to have because they do one thing well and contribute to their side's win objective. A good mafia power role is the Hooker. She stops the biggest problem for the mafia, which is town power roles. This brings me to the suggestions for making good roles:


Tip #1: Keep it simple.

The most complicated role on the site is arguably the Clockmaker. If your role has more rules to it than the Clockmaker, there is probably too much going on there. The best and most used roles do only one thing, and they do it well.

Tip #2: Balance of Power

If the Werewolf was just a role that could eat someone at night and become immune the next day, it would be ridiculous. By imposing the restriction on it that it must correctly guess the role of the person, it makes the Werewolf a high risk and high reward role. Additionally, it is a third party role and doesn't have anyone to help him. Another example is the Bodyguard. He risks his life for the chance to kill another killing role. If your role could completely shut down the other side, you should rethink it into making it either: less powerful, powerful but with a restriction, or a third party role. A good way to limit a powerful role is to only let them use their ability once.

Tip #3: Just Buy It

If your role can be crafted using the custom role maker's logic, it's probably unnecessary.

These roles end up being a stack of existing effects, which usually leads it to being too powerful. If your role is just a villager with a gun and a vest, there's no reason to add it officially. If you really think it should still be a role, buy it with tokens.

Tip #4: Avoid Rehashes

Not all mafia roles need a town version, and vice versa. Additionally, if your role accomplishes the same thing as another role, but with minor variation, really think if it is unique enough. For example, the Cop, the Insane Cop, and the Lazy Cop all receive similar information, but the way they receive it makes a big impact on gameplay.

Tip #5: Don't make "Sandbox Roles"

The most popular way to play mafia in sandbox is obviously with closed roles. Since many of the suggestions are coming from sandbox players, many of them are roles that would almost exclusively be played in sandbox. This usually means the roles have random or absurd effects. A good example of a "sandbox role" is the Clown (https://epicmafia.com/role/13478). Don't make this.

Tip #6: Consider a Setup

What kind of setup would your role work best in? Can you make a theoretical setup that would be fair for both sides that includes your role? If not, consider the classic mafia setup of 3 Villagers, 2 Mafia, 1 Cop, and 1 Doctor. For example, if your role is an investigative role, can you replace the Cop in this setup and have it still be fair for both sides? If your role would only be good in a closed roles setup or a private game (i.e. where people will use the role's effect for roleplaying purposes), rethink it. If your role is a foil to a specific role, consider if the role you are attempting to counter is played enough to warrant something like this (and example being the Miller and the Cop).

Tip #7: What's in a name?

You do not need to add features to a role simply because it would be in character. Simply because a role seems like it should have a gun, knife, or vest does not mean it should start with one. Balance comes before something like this. If you are really bothered by this, consider renaming the role instead.

Following these steps will help you to understand what makes a mafia role good and how to make a role that will have a higher chance of being official.

Edit: Tip 8: Thinking about effects

How does your role affect the game? Sometimes, it's not as obvious as surface level. For instance, a Miller obviously makes a Cop think more about the guilty reports he receives. A role like the Werewolf, however, has a secondary effect. It makes people be very careful about hardclaiming a role, for fear of being eaten. An example of a role that does not really have an extra effect on how the game is played is the Party Host. Ideally, your role should make the players of the game have to consider something new while playing. In other words, don't make it too disregardable.

Edit 2: Tip 9: The Theme

I'm hitting the word limit here, so I'll be brief. Try to convey what the role does through the name. This is the step that should come last. Theme the name around the effect, not vice versa.

Every thread needs a poll. What's the most important tip to consider when making a role?
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over 7 years
I appreciate the effort gone to in this thread to make the new roles as good as they can be. #MakeRolesGreatAgain
over 7 years
New Tip: You can't say "This role looks too overpowered to be mafia or town, better make it third party" without offering a win condition for it.

"Be among the last two surviving players" doesn't count.
over 7 years
I was talking the other night about why the Sandbox Setup is fun and why dedicated sandbox roles are unfun:

http://pastebin.com/j1nryZg5
over 7 years
Say Scruteneer out loud and think how it sounds.

It sounds like someone on a pirate ship. Arrr, Ye captain says that we need a new Scruteneer !

P.S. I am not saying Diabolist is any better. It makes it sound from Diablo.
over 7 years

xxerox says


Golbolco says

Because if you pay off a Scrutineer to help rig the vote, then he becomes (subjectively, of course) evil. In the same way that, going by your logic, if we pay the tailor or the lawyer to aid evildoers, they become evil.


He doesn't rig the vote. He stright off kills the man who changes his vote. This has nothing to do with Scruteneer changing votes.

Besides the name is too complicated and sounds bad. This is my main concern. Really . Honestly i don'd care about the name.


I just want something that will sound nice, and will work perfectly with the effects.




And somehow Diabolist makes it seem more clear about what it does?

Maybe if I explained it to you from how I originally thought of the name. I wanted some name that had to do with voting, specifically monitoring voting. I found the name Scrutineer while googling and it seemed like a nice fit. The Scrutineer was so strict about keeping the votes in order, he would kill you if your dared to change your vote.
over 7 years

Golbolco says

Because if you pay off a Scrutineer to help rig the vote, then he becomes (subjectively, of course) evil. In the same way that, going by your logic, if we pay the tailor or the lawyer to aid evildoers, they become evil.


He doesn't rig the vote. He stright off kills the man who changes his vote. This has nothing to do with Scruteneer changing votes.

Besides the name is too complicated and sounds bad. This is my main concern. Really . Honestly i don'd care about the name.


I just want something that will sound nice, and will work perfectly with the effects.
over 7 years
Because if you pay off a Scrutineer to help rig the vote, then he becomes (subjectively, of course) evil. In the same way that, going by your logic, if we pay the tailor or the lawyer to aid evildoers, they become evil.
over 7 years
but we connect EVIL with Lawyer and Tailor , right ?

If we see in the news - Lawyer protects mafia members, we curse at the Lawyer.

If we see - Bunch of Tailors make costumes for the 10 top crime families , We wont be suprised.


But if we read - National hero who saves kittens is actually mafia member and kills people for fun - We do not believe.

So how can you believe someone who stands for Justice - Scruteneer, is actually a bad guy?

Its not important what the name is . It is important how it sounds and what it stands for. How we see it in our minds.
over 7 years

xxerox says


sl0nderman says


xxerox says

Scrutineer is a bad name.


A scrutineer deals with voting. The role deals with voting. It makes sense. Diabolist is too vague and doesn't portray what the role is supposed to be.


Scrutineer protects votes. The role is maf sided. Just doesn't make sence.


So what do you think of Lawyers and Tailors? They're not evil Italian bootleggers, at least not all of them. A lawyer protects their client from the prosecutor and a tailor sews your clothes on right. Do all Fiddlers drive people to deafness?



Also he casts a spell. Scrutineer's can't cast spells


That's a bit Lucid wrote in to match the name. Sl0nd's original role suggestion lacks it: https://epicmafia.com/role/15625
over 7 years

sl0nderman says


xxerox says

Scrutineer is a bad name.


A scrutineer deals with voting. The role deals with voting. It makes sense. Diabolist is too vague and doesn't portray what the role is supposed to be.


Scrutineer protects votes. The role is maf sided. Just doesn't make sence.

Also he casts a spell. Scrutineer's can't cast spells
over 7 years

xxerox says

Scrutineer is a bad name.


A scrutineer deals with voting. The role deals with voting. It makes sense. Diabolist is too vague and doesn't portray what the role is supposed to be.
over 7 years
Scrutineer is a bad name.
over 7 years
that's lucid's fault for changing a good name
over 7 years
sl0nderman, I think you need a new suggestion on naming roles. Remember to cite the great Scrutineer-Diabolist Quagmire of November 14, 2016.
over 7 years
Cthulhu is primarily used in cult setups anyway, it doesn't matter if it's good against the mafia. It will probably see more play now after the change to insane speech.
over 7 years

sl0nderman says


xxerox says

Actually, can we have a role that blocks voting?


Cthulhu. If the mafia had a vote blocking role I think it would be too OP almost no matter what. The prosecutor is a good substitute for this.


Third sided that blocks votes? Or even town sided. Chtulhu is useless because peole have to visit it and always blocks all mafia, which makes it quiet OP agains the mafia.
over 7 years

xxerox says

Actually, can we have a role that blocks voting?


Cthulhu. If the mafia had a vote blocking role I think it would be too OP almost no matter what. The prosecutor is a good substitute for this.
over 7 years
Actually, can we have a role that blocks voting?
over 7 years
how a role influences gameplay is the most important part of a good role

kind of obvious but i guess a lot of people dont actually consider that there are other roles in the game
over 7 years
An idea for another tip came to me and I've edited it in.
over 7 years
Chess, the game, is complex. The pieces of chess are simple.
over 7 years
Chess is really really complicated. I don't understand your point.
deletedover 7 years
Yeah, simplicity relies on creating strategies with that role. Complications relies on understanding the role and hoping you get it right.

Look at chess. Every piece has a basic function but there can be millions of ways that a game can be played out. As simple as to put it, roles are supposed to be tools that users use with the aim to win, not to make the game too complicated or too random to play.
over 7 years
Amnesiac is not random. The effect of Amnesiac is controlled by the player. An example of a random effect would be the Clown like I said above, or the Anarchist.

Keeping it simple is almost always the best way to make a role. Mafia first and foremost is a game about intuition. Roles with simple yet effective powers make the game more interesting. Roles that are too complicated bog down the game and make it confusing to play around them
over 7 years
Keeping it simple is not always the best option.