Swap the fool for a hooker and we have a great setup
deletedover 8 years
I said all I had about this setup on the setup page. I think it's terrible.
deletedover 8 years
I respect your opinion but I think this is just as competitively viable as SK vs Mafia. As for whether SK vs Mafia is competitively viable, that's another matter.
deletedover 8 years
And as for comparing it to FT3, I don't think so. There's no cop, vig, or hooker.
It might be like FT3 without the night roulette, which is better IMO, because at least it emphasizes scumhunting
deletedover 8 years
fwiw i really wanted fool to be a viable role in comp about two-three years ago, but after mulling it over, it's just too hard to make a third party competitive setup
killer setups are sort of exempt from this because they play their own game within the confines of the game, most third party roles either play their own game outside the confines of the game (i.e. alien, cthulu, etc.) or are subject to the power struggle between town/mafia and have no real viable way to affect the game's outcome (i.e. survivor)
fool is stuck being subjected to playing for mafia while simultaneously having to avoid death without claiming
deletedover 8 years
If you compare it to staple competitive setups of course it looks bad. It uses fool and virgin. But for what it is, as compared to other setups of the same variety, I think it is much better.
deletedover 8 years
only in the scenario where fool doesn't CC, we're assuming that the accepted and consistent meta for d1 is that fool CCs virgin
deletedover 8 years
Compare it to SK vs Mafia though. I think it's better!
scenario b: - virgin is lynched - mafia can't kill n2 - d2 sixway fool does nothing but sit on their hands - town lynches in a 1/5 scenario to win, 4/5 to mislynch and lead to a joint win
fool not claiming d1:
- neither fool nor mafia CC virgin - town lynches in a 1/6 to win, but also a 1/6 to lynch fool for a fool win - if town lynches in the 2/3 to lynch a blue, mafia kills virgin n2 - d2 town has a 1/5 chance to lynch mafia and fool - n3 mafia NKs and fool claims.
you essentially just made fool training 3 but with a ML
deletedover 8 years
Yes.
Fool not ccing is dumb imo because fool would be blowing a chance at a day one win, which is actually the biggest flaw in the setup in favor of fool IMO.
deletedover 8 years
what is mafia's optimal move d1? lynch virgin then survive lynches until they can joint with fool?
I'm not saying this is the perfect assessment of skill at mafia, but I think this is objectively more skill based and better designed than SK vs Mafia, for instance.
deletedover 8 years
I think you're discrediting it because of the roles it uses, but the concept is actually pretty intricate and I'm pretty confident it is also functional for the most part.
Mafia fool roleswaps are freaking awesome imo, though I doubt they'd happen very often. If fool stops claiming virgin, town gets the clear and it's about 50/50 again.
Look at it closely, instead of assuming no thought was put into it because fool IMO
