Give me insider insight into the predominate attitude in the middle east towards the brutal execution of the pilot from Jordan by ISIS.
Because I think this is a turning point in the situation of the area, and it is looking increasingly less likely that all out war with ISIS will be avoided
deletedalmost 10 years
Assad is now the best of a very nasty bunch in Syria (The FSA ceased to be relevant a long time ago) which just about sums that place up.
Yup. This is true.
Who will keep order in Syria and Iraq if we wipe out the IS territory and then withdraw? Nobody. They'll come straight back. And prolonged interventions are a goldmine of recruitment for Islamists.
Disagreed. By and large, the people dislike ISIS as much as we do. I mean they just roasted a fellow Muslim in a freaking cage. A lot of Muslims want these guys as dead as we do. The United States has hopefully learned their lesson about trying to build nations, but ISIS is not a nation. ISIS is an ideological threat and a tumor that either must be combated ideologically (I'm too cynical to believe that this might work) or swiftly and promptly operated on before it grows out of control.
deletedalmost 10 years
Lashka's points are more interesting and worth a rebuttal.
And what happens if we did send troops in? No solution pleases everyone and no compromise will please anyone. If we arm the Kurds to push further against IS, they'll take independence at the end. Turkey and Iraq will never allow that.
There is no solution that pleases everyone, but ISIS cannot be left to fester until they reach a point where they are an actual tangible threat to Western society. Something needs to be done and soon. What that something is, I am not sure. Doing nothing however is the worst possible solution. They are SPECIFICALLY out for our blood.
Iraq itself is a cactus of a country which is little more than an Iranian puppet.
This is a completely and objectively incorrect statement. Iran hates Iraq, and vice versa. Although Iran has embraced Islam in recent decades, ethnically and historically they are still Persian and they are damn proud of that. They think that Iraq belongs to Persia (Historically, it does.) And they consider themselves far superior to the Arabs in pretty much every way. If they thought they could get away with it, Iran would wipe Iraq off of the map in a heartbeat.
deletedalmost 10 years
I'm going to ignore Duke's points because I think they reek of ignorance. If you think A. That radical Islam is not a threat and B. That Islamic nations can effectively combat radical Islam then frankly I think that you are totally insane
deletedalmost 10 years
And what happens if we did send troops in? No solution pleases everyone and no compromise will please anyone. If we arm the Kurds to push further against IS, they'll take independence at the end. Turkey and Iraq will never allow that. Iraq itself is a cactus of a country which is little more than an Iranian puppet, which means the Iraqi Sunnis are always going to be restless. Assad is now the best of a very nasty bunch in Syria (The FSA ceased to be relevant a long time ago) which just about sums that place up. Who will keep order in Syria and Iraq if we wipe out the IS territory and then withdraw? Nobody. They'll come straight back. And prolonged interventions are a goldmine of recruitment for Islamists.
And on whether western countries should interfere, people are torn. They're often too busy trying to deflect the hate they've been getting from this "by association" (a la post-9/11).
deletedalmost 10 years
lokito3 24mon 4d so you ejaculate in a place which isnt your bedroom/toilet?
people who choose to buy into fear-mongering are weak minded and will never be logical in their opinions if someone is pumping them with propaganda that sounds scary.
Egyptian media is, in general, reacting similarly to western media. Full outrage, but with an added "how dare they call this Islam!?". The Egyptians I've met since (incl. 50% cab drivers) have all expressed real concern over the issue. We talked about it in school quite a bit.
Germany was a legitimate threat, no comparison. Muslim radicals were never a threat, and never will be, uneless we keep feeding them weapons. don't forget the totality of this fire has largely been fed with our fuel, so to speak
IS is setting itself up as a replacement to Al-Qaeda by taking declarations of loyalty to the Caliphate from all over the Muslim world. Libyan militias that run half the country (once again, thanks to idiotic Western intervention which has made Libya into Somalia 2.0) have been declaring loyalty to IS. Militants in the Sinai in Egypt. Algerian Islamists. And seemingly up next, Boko Haram. Al Qaeda is now all but irrelevant outside of Yemen. IS has long surpassed it.
deletedalmost 10 years
A quick study of history will show you that this problem is not going to be solved from within. We can ignore it like we ignored Germany I guess but it will just be a bigger problem later on. I would support absolutely any other solution that did not involve military action, if I believed that one existed. Whether the US funded them as part of a proxy war or not is irrelevant. Yeah, we screwed up. Now what is your SOLUTION?
you are right, the only similarity between the two is that we gave them both guns and money
deletedalmost 10 years
Jordan didn't choose to be on the periphery. Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and the UAE, have successfully isolated it and it's one of the least relevant Arab countries these days. Its military, whilst better than the joke of an army Iraq has (our fault again), is no stronger than Assads Syrian army and in fact, if Assad wasn't fighting on 10000 fronts, it would be less capable than him.
IS want the west to send troops. You think the propaganda videos of them beheading journalists were bad? They were successful though. Imagine when they start capturing and executing American soldiers on camera? Flocks more would-be jjihadists would sign up. If the west sends troops, IS will go guerilla like the Taliban and there is no way the west can stomach the measures needed to beat a foe like that. 10 years failed to kill off the Taliban, and they're stronger than ever since 2001 now. There is no public stomach for prolonged war anywhere in the West, unless your name is John McCain.
they have to purge this crisis themselves. no way around it. unless this happens we will do nothing but prop up another faction that will later be a threat.
don't forget that the middle east was relatively peaceful until we propped up the old Iranian equivalent of monarchy to take down a secular democracy that didn't want the British taking their oil.
This resulted in yet another overthrow of that monarchy (this time by radical Muslims) which we had to combat by making allies with opposing sects of islam... who persecuted their enemies with our money and guns.
this led to supporting iraq to combat radical islam throughout the region... then russia felt the need to have a presence in Afghanistan thinking their security was threatened with us causing chaos in their back yard.
then we propped up al-queda to combat them in Afghanistan.... we all know how that turned out.
stop. just stop.
deletedalmost 10 years
ISIS is not Al Qaeda and comparing the situation with ISIS to the situation with Al Qaeda from 2003-2013 is totally asinine in my opinion.
ISIS executed the Japanese hostages despite Japan being seemingly open to paying their ransom
ISIS just used a method of execution much more brutal than beheading, and they used it against a citizen of a country that engaged in war against Israel and has, as riot said, "fallen to the periphery."
The difference between ISIS and Al Qaeda is that ISIS WANTS a full fledged war, and they intend to get it.
deletedalmost 10 years
If no action is taken from nations outside of the middle east, it is extremely likely that ISIS will be a major geopolitical power in the region a decade or two from now.
It's hard for nations that are actually in the middle east to combat ISIS, because the war they intend to wage is ideological. When contemporary middle eastern ideology lends sympathy to them from within, it is clear that the problem cannot be solved from within.
deletedalmost 10 years
That would be a formidable solution if any of the other nations cared as much as the USA did.
this + american money directly funded ISIS before, and still indirectly funds ISIS. USA meddling in the affairs of the world creates more problems than it solves. always.
