is giving birth moral77

Carmen11mon 27d
+3

Honestly it's not. I know antinatalism isn't a popular moral philosophy, but it's the only one that makes any sense.

The root of all morality is suffering. In a universe where suffering was impossible, morality wouldn't exist. Nothing is capable of suffering in our universe except for life. The basis of all life is destruction; for life to continue, it must destroy other life for sustenance in some way.

People are the first to say that suffering is a part of life - I agree with that! However, I'm for some reason the only to admit that's a BAD thing. When you create a life, whether you're a deer dooming a fawn to an existence of fear and pain, or a human dooming a child to an existence of existential dread and all the other evils in our society, you're creating suffering where there was none before.

A deer has the excuse of doing that because of its inescapable nature and instinct. It doesn't excuse the deer from doing something morally wrong, but animals obviously don't have the logical process to even grasp morality anyway. A human parent, however, dooms their child to 100 years of pointless existence for no reason other than vain ones of passing down their name, or having something they can raise. Both are selfish reasons.

When you're born, it's all damage control from there on out. We must strive to lessen the suffering as much as we can, to make sure all individuals have their human rights respected by the society, and to preserve everyone's body autonomy. You're obligated to do nothing at all from being born - it's a curse and the society should be expected to be as moral and decent as possible in all other ways. However, no society is a utopia, which would be the only one where life would be morally permissible.

To conclude, life in general is evil. The great "circle of life" is probably the most sick and disgusting institution imaginable, yet it's idolized for some reason. A wolf devours a rabbit alive, causing unimaginable physical pain for the small animal that never even asked to exist. And that's ONE meal for a SINGLE wolf. This kind of horror goes on every day, and has been for millennia. It makes me sick to think about, and it's the worst when people defend our cruel biology, society, and humanity.

Your thoughts below

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wink1mon 20d
+2
fellas is it gay to exist
VanityPrime1mon 20d
+1
bansheewhat
so without people there would be no suffering, and thus carmen is right...?
without people, there wouldn't be values that people would have, and we wouldn't care about suffering to begin with, in order to prove the statement;

"people would be better off without people"

you have to presuppose the value of people, which defeats the argument. it's self-contradictory.
Ominoire1mon 20d
No meaning in life.

Create a meaning in life.
peach1mon 20d
+23
what if i like to suffer
deleted1mon 20d
better and more meaningful query: is undoing the harmful effects of me being born (e.g. me being alive) moral? probably, if i find someone to take care of my dog beforehand
Matt121mon 20d
girl shut up
nbtnbt51mon 20d
essa
better and more meaningful query: is undoing the harmful effects of me being born (e.g. me being alive) moral? probably, if i find someone to take care of my dog beforehand
logged in just to say this: no
please never bring up this query again, thanks!
Carmen1mon 20d
-1
nbtnbt5
essa
better and more meaningful query: is undoing the harmful effects of me being born (e.g. me being alive) moral? probably, if i find someone to take care of my dog beforehand
logged in just to say this: no
please never bring up this query again, thanks!
Suicide is rarely the answer, but in no way is it immoral to self-terminate
wink1mon 20d
+2
as much as i am a huge advocate for suicide prevention, you have a right to death just as much as a right to life.
Soluciones1mon 20d
do you not enjoy life?
sleepytobito1mon 20d
+2
Soluciones
do you not enjoy life?
i enjoy it at least a little bit more thanks to you luci <3
Matt121mon 13d
Matt12
girl shut up
Wunderkind1mon 13d
i used to think this when i was 16. thankfully i grew up and realized it was just my depression doing the thinking for me, never noticing the joy if it wasnt right in my face. if life wasnt worth living everyone would just off themselves. sure sometimes it's unjust and sometimes people are unfortunate but deep down everyone want to live safe and good life without guilt and suffering and loneliness. once you get the taste of that, you will gamble everything to have shot at it.
JM1231mon 13d
is shaving pubes moral
relaxiii1mon 12d
i changed my mind to yes after correcting my neurochemistry through proper nutrition and daily exposure to sunlight

vitality justifies itself
Reads David Benatar once:
Seriously though, if you really are really interested in antinatalism and procreation in general you might want to read the Stanford article on 'Parenthood and Procreation'

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/parenthood/

And since a question of life's purpose and morality being a cultural phenomenon or being based on pleasure and pain, you may want to also read the Meaning of life article as well as the one on Metaethics:

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/life-meaning/

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/well-being/


https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/metaethics/

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/moral-realism/

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/moral-relativism/
is giving birth morally ok